Talk:Alpe d'Huez
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[edit] old comments
The TdF website states that the grade is 7.9%, not 8.1% as in the article. "Km 187 - L'ALPE-D'HUEZ - 13.8 km climb to 7.9 % - H Category" (http://www.letour.com/2006/TDF/LIVE/us/1500/dprofil.html) Anyone care to comment. Otherwise, I'll chnage the article.
The pages for Le Tour (and other similar pages, like the World Cycling Championships) list winners in chronological order, i.e., oldest to most recent. Any particular reason this page is backwards? (It confused me for a minute.) (Is there any Wikipedia guideline for this sort of thing?)
[edit] Conflicting data about Pantani's record.
The text says that Pantani's record is 37'35", but the "fastest ascent" table claims 36'50". Which is correct?
- I'm not actually sure...it also says Pantani's record is one second better than Lance Armstrong's 37'36" but the tables never mention anything about a 37'35" (they do mention 37'15").
-Later Edit- However, I have found this source: http://www.gastrobiking.com/region/alpe_dhuez.html
The climb has been timed since 1994 so earlier times are not available. From 1994 to 1997 the climb was timed from a point 14.5km from the finish. Since 1999 a photo-finish system was used from 14km to the finish. These times are all taken from 13.8km from the summit ie. from the corner which marks the start of the climb. Other timings have also been taken from the road junction approximately 700m from the start of the climb.
Apparently, certain times have been corrected to be from 13.8km from the finish. I will put this in the article.
Also see cyclingnews.com report on 2004 TdF: http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2004/tour04/?id=results/stage16 Note: Armstrong's time over the 13.8 km of climbing (excluding the 1.7 km of flat at the start) was 37'36, one second slower than Marco Pantani's "official" record of 37'35 set in 1997. But Pantani's time was actually 36'55 when measured from the start of the climb (as Armstrong was today). Pantani also rode 36'50 for the climb in 1995, which remains the best performance up l'Alpe d'Huez. RosinDebow 03:14, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
I've added another para which I hope adds additional information to the discussion, as well as the link to the Cycling News story. GuyWR
The links you guys provide have conflictive data. Pantani's best performance over the 13.8 km of climbing was in 1997 (37:35). I have just checked several cycling magazines from the time as well as videos and the final timings of other riders finishing after the winners. I have therefore updated the table which I think is now 99% correct. For example Pantani rode 38:04 in 1995, Indurain and Zulle who finished 2nd and 3rd respectively arrived 1:24 minutes later, therefore their climbing times were 39:28. I did the same for other years.
- The table looks good, but might be in need of an update already. Procycling mag, Jan 2007, lists the following times from the 2006 stage of the Tour. Frank Schleck: 40'46"; Floyd Landis and Andreas Kloden: 38'36". GuyWR
- I had added Floyd Landis at 38'34" and Andreas Kloden at 38'35" which was from the July 19th, 2006 edition of l'Equipe -- I assume that the TdF doesn't offer official times.. these are probably obtained unofficially from individuals at various reporting angencies. It should also be noted that this table is VERY incomplete. scotts 21:42, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
- I agree that the table is very incomplete - a bunch of times from several sources and some potentially dubious historical numbers (where did Coppi's time come from, for example?). I wonder, though, if we're getting close at all; or, would it be better represented as a 'selection of times for the climb' rather than a ranking of the supposed fastest? GuyWR
I made some further changes to the table, based on an article in the UK magazine Procycling (procycling.com) - see my note above - that also includes historical times over the last 20 years. I therefore added some new times at the bottom of the table, which appear plausible given the individuals and the eras. I also added Jose Azevedo, only 4" slower than Kloden in 2004; the problem with this 'count back' approach for the ITT is that it assumes all the riders did the same time for the first stretch from Bourg d'Oisans to the base of the climb (which is a reasonable assumption given the short distance), so I've left it at 'The Ace' for now and not added any others. GuyWR
[edit] Basque Rider
Is it really fair to characterize Iban Mayo as a Basque rider? The American riders and not referred to by their ethnic origin. Shouldn't he just be called Spanish for these purposes? User: Nlsanand
Evito 05:53, 7 June 2006 (UTC)
I have made the change, as no one has spoken. 1 August, 2006. User: Nlsanand
[edit] dutch mountain
i wonder if the title "dutch mountain" is at all relevant to this article regardless of the amount of dutch cyclists that actually won the tour the France etappe on this mountain, the fact remains that only the dutch call it the dutch mountain, based on some arrogant notion that becaues "we call it like that in holland, so it's a fact and should be in the article , cause after all ,we won there more then others" big deal
you will not hear French folks , let alone folks that actually live on the mountain call it "the dutch mountain"
furthermore, Alpe d'Huez is a lot more then simply a mountain stage of the tour de FRance, it's also a ski resort and so on...
and let's face it , everybody knows that holland is flat as a pancake so a dutch mountain ... in their dreams
-
- Please, there's no need to attack the Dutch. Here's a couple of non-Dutch sites that mentions Dutch Mountain: [1] [2] [3]. I'm reverting your edit for these reasons. --Turbothy 11:07, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
- Oh, by the way - highest point in Denmark is only half as high as the highest point in the Netherlands, and Michael Rasmussen wins the polka dot jersey for the second consecutive year now, so clearly nationality has no impact on whether you can ride a bike up a mountain. --Turbothy 11:07, 20 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Ski hill details?
The article starts by claiming that the Alpe is a 1850 m ski hill. Looking at the image one cannot help but be confused, as it looks like the slope in the background is perhaps 150 m at most. I noticed later on the page that the BOTTOM of the hill is at 1850 m... So is the ski area of the hill actually much smaller? If so, this should be what appears in the intro! Maury
the whole mountain is a ski resort, it links up with the "Les Deux Alpes" resort
the article focusses to much on cycling and as such the pic show roads , not ski resorts just do an image search on google for "alpe d'huez ski" ,and you'll see
it's actually one of the better places to go skiing in france, if you can go outside the common holidays...
the pic in the article is basically the top of the mountain that's allready high up in the mountain , during winter that area is white, that road isn't accessible then either
[edit] Bends named after riders?
Aren't some of the bends named after riders? I know one of them is named after Joaquim Agostinho but what about the rest? Wouldn't it be an interesting addition to the article? Orta 01:33, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
- I added this information to the table of winners. Doctormatt 23:53, 27 October 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Map of the climb
The map of the climb is actually inaccurate, as it shows the final corners going to the right above Huez, when they should go to the left and enter the town of Alpe d'Huez from the left of the picture. GuyWR
