Talk:Devo 2.0
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[edit] Alleged Disneyfication
I did some editing in an attempt to meet NPOV, and because after listening to the album many times over the last week, and comparing to the original songs, I feel that the changes in the lyrics aren't as widespread as previously reported, and the "sanitation", while present, is not nearly as invasive and sweeping as some have claimed. For example, "Uncontrollable Urge", one of Devo's more suggestive songs from their early years, is left almost entire intact. Granted, this probably means that Disney is hoping the listeners will assume Nicole is talking about food when she said "before dinner, after lunch, I get a snack attack, I need to munch", but they're leaving it open for interpretation, rather than eliminating it. The only song that was "completely re-written" was "Jerkin' Back 'n Forth", and it wasn't to remove anything sexual; the original song was about a codependent relationship that the narrator wants to leave but can't, and the new version is about how the subject's music causes the narrator to move involuntarily. For the rest of the songs, however, less than half of the lyrics were changed, and in a lot of cases it was a shifting of focus, either because of the age group of the band and target audience, or because of the gender of the singer (although "Big Mess" leaves the word "cowboy" alone, making for some really weird lyrics). I'm not saying that my revision is perfect, but if someone's wants to change it, I think we need to keep our opinions out of it. Many bitter Devo fans are foaming at the mouth because of what they percieve as a total violation of the Devo ethic, and want to throw the ideas of "sanitation" and "complete rewrite" all over the place, but this isn't the place for that sort of thing.
I think this article deals with the subject fairly well (I was almost tempted to add it to the external links section, but I don't think there's any need to flood the section with every Dev2.0-related article out there). - Ugliness Man 03:35, 17 March 2006
- huh... somehow I forgot that I said yesterday that I wouldn't bother adding that link, and I went ahead and added it today... oh well, I'm going to leave it, I think it's relevant, but I won't get pissy if someone removes it. - Ugliness Man 14:02, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
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- I think it's relevant too, it's a good summary of the issues and useful to get the perspective of Jerry Casale too. --looceefir 14:13, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
[edit] 'Recorded by original band members'?
Can anyone verify the list of 'original band members' who have re-recorded the Dev2.0 music? I was under the impression it was only Jerry Casale involved in that side of things. Can't find a link just now, if someone has the CD, is this information contained there?
- The press release verifies that Gerald V. Casale and Mark Mothersbaugh are involved. This same press release also lists the members of Devo as Gerald, Mark, and the two namesake Bobs, but cleverly avoids saying whether or not said Bobs were invovled in this. I wish I had a copy of the CD but none of the stores in this stupid town got copies when it was released, so I'm stuck with just my advance copy for another week. - Ugliness Man 13:56, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
- Also, I want to thank you for revising my paragraph about fan polarization, it was a big improvement. Cheers - Ugliness Man 14:00, 18 March 2006 (UTC)
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- After more than a month, the retail copy that I ordered finally came in yesterday! This means I have the official liner notes with the complete and confirmed credits. I will type out the credits in their entirety exactly as they appear in the liner notes and providing an external link on this discussion page for reference. In the meantime, I will make some adjustments to the article. I'm removing the instrument credits, because they don't actually play the instruments on the album itself, and using quotation marks to suggest that just messes up the asthetics, IMO. If someone wants to revert that part, however, I won't complain or change it back. And for the record, I am using the name spellings in the liner notes. The only reason I mention this is that some of the members seem to have two or more names, depending on the source (Jerry/Gerry/Gerald, and Robert/Bob). - Ugliness Man 13:40, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
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- Okay, I typed up the notes as a post in a LiveJournal Devo community. Again, I am providing this link only for a point of reference, I am aware this doesn't count as an official source by any means. For the non-kid credits, I only included the four members of the original Devo who were involved. I omitted the other major contributors because they weren't original Devo members, and I wasn't sure how to adjust that part of the info box accordingly. Anyway, here's the link: [1] - Ugliness Man 14:07, 25 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Polarization.
The bit about the polarization of fans and critcism was delted for not being "cited". I was told once that LiveJournal articles don't count as citations since "anyone" can post them, but since what's at issue is views and opinions of fans, I think links to discussions among fans is valid citation. So here's some specific discussions on a LiveJournal community for Devo fans: [2] [3] [4] [5] [6], [7]
I hope whoever decided that it's "unciteable" might reconsider, but I'm not going to restore the article because I don't want to be accused of vandalism. - Ugliness Man 17:41, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
- Even if message board chatter was an acceptable source for Wikipedia - and it isn't - you can't cite message board posts from YOURSELF! wikipediatrix 18:15, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
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- It's not just my comments on those threads that's relevant, it's the reaction of others. Some of those fans are declaring that it's the stupidest thing ever, but others are saying that it's a perfect example of de-evolution in progress. Even if you completely removed my contributions from those conversations, the dispute is still obvious. - Ugliness Man 19:52, 22 June 2006 (UTC)
- I was the one that removed it for being unverifiable. In this case, Wikipediatrix is correct- the message board chatter really doesn't meet WP:V in this case. I would say, however, that if reported on by a source other than Wikipedia, they might merit inclusion in the article. In the meantime, without an external source surveying the totality of the Devo "community" (a rather overused term, IMHO) and being able to render a semi-authoritative judgment on whether or not these postings are indicative of a larger trend, it's my opinion that including the message postings in the article would be premature. On some of the livejournal communities I frequent and post to, we have heated debates about the subjects of our interest, but those debates aren't necessarily indicative of a larger and notable trend.Captainktainer * Talk 14:45, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
- Oh, by the way, reinserting the material wouldn't be considered vandalism, per se, but after the discussion in this talk page (which I should have initiated when I made the edit, and I apologize), it would probably be seen as being bad form. If consensus is in favor, though, by all means, be bold; you don't need permission from me or any other single individual.Captainktainer * Talk 14:45, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Monkey's Uncle
There was a compilation album released April 4 (although I heard about it less than a week ago), called Disneymania Vol. 4[8]. The last track is "Monkey's Uncle" by Devo 2.0. Apparantly, these Disneymania compilations consist of modern pop artists doing songs from Disney movies, and there is a 1965 Disney movie called The Monkey's Uncle, so you can see where this is going... however, it's an assumption and not something confirmed. I've already mentioned this in the movie's talk page, but it would be nice if someone who knows how to research such things better than I do could dig up the relevant info on this and add a mention of it to the article. - Ugliness Man 14:21, 29 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Alan Myers
Alan Myers did not play on the DEVO 2.0 Instrumentals. He has not been involved in ANYTHING related to Devo since 1985. The liner notes cite Neil Taylor as the drummer, except for "Whip It" and "The Winner" which feature Josh Freese. DarKrow 08:14, 21 November 2006 (UTC)
