Talk:Hell's Kitchen, Manhattan

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Contents 1 POV 2 Disambiguation 3 Derivation 4 original research 5 Clinton and Hell's Kitchen. 6 How is this paragraph POV? 7 Map request 8 COBU

[edit] POV

The sentence "keep dreaming fellas, you'll never destroy our heritage" is total POV and I removed it.

[edit] Disambiguation

I was looking for the reality show on FOX. There should probably be a disambiguation page so that one can select this without having to scroll to the bottom of this Hell's Kitchen page.

Good idea. I've created Hell's Kitchen (disambiguation). Several of the links to this article still need to be changed, though. JamesMLane 7 July 2005 22:31 (UTC)

I removed the material about Hell's Kitchen, Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada from here and created a stub for it, which I also added to the disambiguation page. -- Lisasmall 08:31, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

A link to the disambiguation page might help... I added one. Edokter 20:41, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Derivation

Is the Derivation section copied from the last paragraph of http://www.midtownmedia.com/chronicle/HKhistory.htm

I don't know the actual boundaries of Hell's kitchen, but I do know that "35st" makes no sense. This page mentions 34th Street being the southern boundary, but I can't verify it, so I'm hesitant to make an edit at all.

[edit] original research

Today Hell's Kitchen is a mixed neighborhood of yuppies, artists, hipsters, longtime Irish, Puerto Rican, and Dominican residents, and an increasing number of gays. Now largely free from street crime, it is, for the most part, removed from the degree of gangsterism which has long characterized the neighborhood.

For example what is this paragraph based on? it has no citation.--Crossmr 21:28, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Clinton and Hell's Kitchen.

Call me crazy, but when I was younger I remember distinctly that Clinton referred to everything on the west side north of Chelsea-which ended at 23rd/234th - and south of 42nd. I distinctly remember a friend that lived in Clinton, and he was on 25th. Hell's kitchen was a smaller area north of 42nd, and west of broadway. There's definitely been some real-estate, and government "adjustment" of these names here. Not surprising, but it should be noted. Especially since the this article isn't consistent with the Chelsea article. Chelsea is stated to end at 23rd, yet this article states that Clinton goes from 34th to 57th and overlaps with Chelsea. Something is a bit wonky, it can probably be solved by someone digging up some history on the name. For reference the East Village article does a good job of noting that it used to be Lower East Side, and why it changed/is changing back. Domhail 18:15, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] How is this paragraph POV?

"The names of places in New York City change, either due to the influence of land developers, the City government, or because a name no longer suits a neighborhood's character. A name never changes, though, unless the residents of the city collectively adopt it, which usually takes years and is an uninformal process whereby most people begin to refer to an area by its new name. A recent new name that took root is DUMBO, whereas referring to Hell's Kitchen as "Clinton" has largely been eschewed. Similarly, New York resident rarely refer to Sixth Avenue as Avenue of the Americas. A new neighborhood name may be controversial, as may be its perceived boundaries."

How is that POV? --DavidShankBone 18:22, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Hi David: My rationale for nuking the paragraph would more accurately be that it is off topic (e.g., Sixth Avenue and DUMBO are not Hell's Kitchen) and doesn't really add anything about the hood to the article. Along with that nuke I also reverted a less precise address for Manhattan Plaza (that was done by the previous poster) Americasroof 18:36, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

The reason I included it was because I am often asked by out-of-towners why one place has two names. I've lived in my adult life, for long stretches of time in six states and 15 cities around the country, and I've never seen such a battle over names of places, or such passion. The reasons are obvious. But do you not think that helps to give context? The wording can be changed (perhaps not "eschewed"), but I thought it was good. No? --DavidShankBone 18:58, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

While I still feel it is probably off topic, I would be interested in what others say. I won't wrestle over it. Thanks for asking. Americasroof 20:10, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

i know hell's kitchen from the dream theater song... nice place..

[edit] Map request

It is requested that a map or maps be included in this article to improve its quality. Wikipedians in New York may be able to help!

[edit] COBU

While fascinating, and a connection to Hells Kitchen, perhaps some of this COBU info should go into Church of bible understanding instead? dm 16:44, 11 March 2007 (UTC)