User talk:203.11.72.4
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The Wikipedia Tutorial is a good place to start learning about Wikipedia. For now, if you are stuck, you can click the edit this page tab above, type {{helpme}} in the edit box, and then click Save Page; an experienced Wikipedian will be around shortly to answer any questions you may have. Also feel free to ask a question on my talk page. I will answer your questions as far as I can! Thank you again for contributing to Wikipedia. John Vandenberg 01:55, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
In regards to your changes to PETA, I have reverted them because they were not really necessary. The link to 1980 doesnt give the reader the opportunity to understand peripheral information about PETA. At the bottom of the page there is a link to Category:1980 establishments which the reader can use to find out more about the year. The link to Norfolk, Virginia allows the reader to verify that PETA was indeed started in the U.S.; it doesnt need to be exlained.
Anyway, keep at it. We have a Manual of Style that you can use to find out how wikipedia articles are best written, but by all means keep making changes -- some of your changes will end up being reverted, but others will stick. John Vandenberg 01:55, 21 December 2006 (UTC)
Hi John, I've noticed there is a discrepency in Wikipedia, where locations in the United States are often referred to without the country name, whereas locations in other countries are usually referred to with the country name, as if everyone is supposed to know place names in the United States, but not elsewhere. I did take a quick look at your profile, and noticed that you are in Australia, which is an extreemly Americo-centric country (wether you realise that or not), but not everywhere (especially outside the English speaking world) is the same.
I really like the Wikipedia concept a lot, but from reading a few articles and the general comments, I can see now that this website has a very strong American-centric viewpoint, especially when it comes to some of the more politically sensitive topics such as the American war in Iraq (no mention at all of American war crimes!), the Israeli state and occupation of Palestine, and so on and on.
I almost thing we really need another Wikipedia where a more neutral point of view, or else opposing points of view, can be enered. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 203.11.72.4 (talk • contribs) 03:59, 22 December 2006.
- While you are not far from the mark regarding Australia the country being Americanised, most Australians wish this was not the case. Personally I am definitely not, and my reason for removing the country name on PETA is entirely unrelated. Everywhere in wikipedia, article names are given on a first-come-first-served basis, however they are then renamed as required to make room for other articles that need to have a similar name, and disambiguation pages are created. In the case of "Norfolk, Virginia", that article name is sufficiently unique to avoid conflicts with all of the other Norfolks. As a result, when another article (i.e. PETA in this case) needs to refer to the Norfolk in the USA state of Virginia, they usually use Norfolk, Virginia -- if the reader is still in doubt which Norfolk that is, the reader can click on the link. A more extreme case is Kent being the english county, even though there are other Kents which are also as notable -- notice that on Hops, Kent is used without further qualification. However I am not saying that Wikipedia is perfect -- im sure there are many cases where the naming of articles is biased, and where the text omits sufficient context for people who are not American. All I can say is that these issues are being dealt with by Wikipedia policies, and that these policies are not written by Americans.
- It is nice to hear you are concerned about neutral point of view (NPOV) -- it is one of the fundamental Wikipedia principles, so please help us. There are definately pro-American people on Wikipedia that dont like anti-American points of view, and often cant distinguish between anti-American and neutral. For this reason, I suggest you dont start by trying to establish NPOV on those types of articles. First tackle less contentious issues, and build up an editing history that shows that you are able to strive towards NPOV on any topic. Consider going to, finding an interesting article, identify the contentious part of the article, and initiating a discussion on the articles talk page. If there is no feedback from others be bold and make some changes to improve the article.
- For example, see All-Tatar Public Center. I couldnt easily work out what was being disputed. If you have a look at the history[1]: it has all been written by one person (Untifler) so I am guessing that user would be able to tell us which facts are disputed, and why.
- Also, I warn you that you will not be very successful making contentious changes until you have created an account. Changes made by an IP address draw a lot of unnecessary attention. If you do create an account, I would love to know your username so we can continue communicating. John Vandenberg 13:01, 27 December 2006 (UTC)
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