Talk:A.S. Roma

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AS Roma is one of the best clubs in Italy and is followed by millions of supporters worldwide. Que?????

They boast a wide variety of talented players through out the ages. None more than Francessco Totti. The eternal golden boy of the Romanista and the Italy, his ingenious vision for the game, he is able to play the ball to his playmates in patterns that seem inconcievable to even some of the world's finest. Add his powerful shot and his natural leadership makes him one of the most covetable players in the world.

Roma has won the scudetto 3 times even though it is not run by one of the rich companies that often finance other northern clubs like AC Milan, Inter Milan and Juventus. This club is very loyal to it's fans and they have a rich history with supporting the team.

Roma also compltely overshadows the other roman team that wears blue. SS Lazio tries their best to compete with us, but they aren't just good enough and some people just never know when to quit.

Roma's colors are Red and Yellow which refer to the colors of Gillarossi. Their symbol is a mother wolf feeding Regalus and Ramos. Roma plays at the Olympic stadium and their training headquarters are at the Trigora

Contents 1 Translation 2 UEFA Cup Match 3 Leandro Greco 4 Mirko Vučinić 5 More Transfers 6 Someone is changing the team 7 Mirko Vucinic and Lee Young-Pyo in AS Roma? 8 Club Foundation Date (S.S. Lazio 1900/A.S. Roma 1927) 9 Flags 10 Protected

[edit] Translation

I thought it would be better if I took the Roma article from the italian wikipedia and just translated it to english and replaced this article...the italian version is quite extensive and would do us romanisti proud, as no other football club on english wikipedia would have such an awesome article...sangue e oro per sempre <3

• Uhmmm do you want a propaganda piece for the club or do you want something remotely factual?

I'll weed out anything blatant..its really not that bad though

I'm having some problems getting things arranged properly ... the table of contents needs to be higher up, and the text needs to wrap around the "list of presidents" table a little better. Any help would be great :)

[edit] UEFA Cup Match

Why were they dressed as clowns for the UEFA cup match against middlesborough? as seen here with their brightly, but differently coloured sleeves, I find it difficult to take them seriously....Philc _T+C 22:29, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

You're late for April's Fool day. And even later for Carnival. Thanks for existing.--Panairjdde 00:33, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

Eh? I was serious, even if they're not actually dressed as clowns, that what they look like to me, ther kit is ridiculous, and I was wondering which kit it was, as it doesnt match any of the Strips I can find. With their main strip being red, their second strip being white, and ther third orange, what is this strip that appears to be a mixture of all three!? Philc _T+C 00:57, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

It's just the team jersey for the UEFA Cup. Anyway, Wikipedia is not a forum, so please stop talking about this rubbish, and let's be involved on articles. --Angelo 01:26, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Leandro Greco

Is Leandro Greco still on AS Roma? I've verified he was on the roster for the 04-05 season and was a sub in one game, but he's not even on the official site's roster for 05-06: La Squadra There also doesn't appear to be a picture of him anywhere online, unless I'm missing an accent or something like that. I can't find anything on him. Though this site appears to say he was in two Coppa Italia games as a sub:
Yahoo IT This is the only player I haven't found on the rosters on any fan sites or official sites so far.
--KingPenguin 01:17, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

He is currently playing for AS Roma's primavera youth squad: [1] --Angelo 17:04, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mirko Vučinić

Mirko Vučinić has been transfered to A.S. Roma for £5.54m. [Football Transfers]

Kal 03:45, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

The edit I made was changed even with link to source. Vandalism or incompitence?

I have to stress the fact that this tranfer seems to be higly possible, but not really completed: no italian sport site, nor newspaper, nor tv/radio sport report, nor Roma or Lecce blog or supporter' site, nor official sites have yet confirmed - after ten days - this transfer; instead they are continuing to speak about it in terms of "possibility" and "future". Please note that, since AS Roma quotes are negotiated on the italian stock market, the club must promptly declare any player acquisition (in the past, the main channel for such advices beeing the AS Roma official site). Ciao :-) -- Pap3rinik (talk) 10:57, 25 August 2006 (UTC)

All done and over with now. Again I still stand correct on one portion that this was completed long ago as mentioned by transfer website and foreign media. However, they were incorrect to release the correct terms as this is only a loan? -- Kal 23:04, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] More Transfers

David Pizarro, Raffaele Longo, Gianluca Comotto, and one youth player have new transfer status with Roma according to this source. Make sure you read the bottom paragraph for the other players than Pizarro. -KingPenguin 02:26, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Someone is changing the team

Wikipedia is an encyclopedia,not a "create your team",and there are people that don´t have a profile,are messing the team,and if AS Roma updated the site a few days ago,and who is Pietro Pippolo?Is a young player?Because he´s profile doesn´t make part in the oficial team on the website!

Pietro Pipolo is the youth player in the squad since last season, currently, with Carlo Zotti, playing with Primavera team. Usually Zotti start. Matthew_hk tc 02:29, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Mirko Vucinic and Lee Young-Pyo in AS Roma?

Where does this information come from? I heard about the transfer of Marko Vucinic,but in Lee Young-Pyo´s case i only can tell that it´s a lie. --Tiago Heitor 21:33, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

ok Tiago fagman there are many sources about lee young pyo. its not a lie. if you really cared about the club you would know this information and not just be sitting on your lazy ass monitoring this wikipedia page. http://www.goal.com/en/articolo.aspx?ContenutoId=118078

Calmdown,there is no need to start insulting people,estás a entender,nao sejas palhaço!!!Maybe if he is linked with AS Roma,this is rubbish information,because its not confirmed yet and could not go on,and due to the fact that this is an encyclopedia...Next thing,if you want to do this tipe of things,subscribe Wikipedia,don´t be a coward without a name!You don´t have to pay,you can edit watever you want to edit(except if you vandalise the pages) without be reversed,and we could discuss this like men!!!And yes,i like AS Roma,that´s why i care with the article and rubbish information(so far)that some people put there. --Tiago Heitor 11:08, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

The transfer of Mirko Vučinić is now official: see here or the pdf on AS Roma official site. No words on the same site for Lee Young-Pyo, thus I guess these are only rumors. Ciao -- Pap3rinik (talk) 15:37, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

It ends up it was a huge lie, since Roma was interested in another Totthenam defender, Rodrigo Defendi (nomen omen). Luckyly we did not get this Korean def.--BaldClarke 16:38, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! --Tiago Heitor 17:00, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

Actually this message has been posted on AS Roma official site about the Lee Young-Pyo case:

“	L’accordo era stato perfezionato, in tutti i suoi dettagli, sia con il Tottenham Hotspur Football and Athletic Co Ltd., che con il procuratore di Lee, Mr Kim; quando tutto era definito, anche l’orario delle visite mediche, inaspettatamente e senza motivo alcuno, il calciatore ha detto di non volere più il trasferimento alla Roma, adducendo ragioni personali di natura religiosa. A questo punto , pur con grande sorpresa, la società ha preso atto e rispettato la decisione del calciatore.	”
	— Mr. Daniele Pradè (AS Roma DS) on August 30, 2006, (http://www.asroma.it/NewsDoc.aspx?Categoria=ITArchivioNews&Documento=6249)

“	A detailed agreement had been concluded, both with Tottenham Hotspur Football and Athletic Co Ltd. and with Mr. Lee manager, Mr Kim; when everything was defined - even the medical check-up schedule - unexpectedly and without any apparent reason the player declared his unavailability to be transferred to AS Roma, claiming personal religious reasons. Subsequently, and not without any surprise, the AS Roma took into account and respected the palyer decision.	”
	— Mr. Daniele Pradè (AS Roma DS) on August 30, 2006, free transaltion by Pap3rinik

-- Pap3rinik (talk) 17:03, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

So how comes that they immediately signed for Defendi?--BaldClarke 17:12, 30 August 2006 (UTC)

I guess that the transfer of Defendi is a compensation in return for Lee. Don't seems very complicated. :-) -- Pap3rinik (..chiedi ad Archimede) 08:53, 31 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Club Foundation Date (S.S. Lazio 1900/A.S. Roma 1927)

Anyone who is familiar with football in Rome knows that 1900 versus 1927 distinction between Lazio and Roma is a particularly sore point for romanisti - the manipulation of dates and irrelevant information in this article testify to this. Why are the foundation dates of clubs that don't exist anymore of any relevance to an article about a club founded in 1927? Is this Roman FC's or Fortitudo's Wikipedia entry?

Soccer played in south central Italy before 1910 is not officially recognized by the Italian FA (FIGC). This is the reason that 1910 is sometimes used as the year that Lazio's football section was founded, however the club was founded in 1900 and football was played by its members in 1901, with official matches starting in 1902. 1910 is in fact the year that the club was affiliated to the Lega Centromeridionale (South Central League, roughly translated) and participated in the first official Italian FA-sanctioned championship.

Therefore if Lazio has allegedly only been active since 1910 the other clubs mentioned could not have started prior to that date, as is misleadingly stated in the main article! What we are looking at here is club foundation dates, and Lazio's is 1900, whether you like it or not.

As far as Roman FC's beginnings are concerned, historical sources are inconclusive and contradictory. Some say that it was founded in 1901, some in 1903, others go as far back as 1895, 1897 or 1899. In any case, it would appear that Roman FC did not play soccer initially but more of a hybrid between the latter and rugby.

One thing which is certain as far as Lazio's footballing activity is concerned, is that there is ample testimony and documentation from the first decade of the 20th century regarding its football "activity" whereas similar information regarding other teams is sorely lacking. In addition, the difference in level between Lazio and other teams, evidenced by the thrashings inflicted on rivals, is another clue as to Lazio's dominance by being a precursor in Rome..

You make many claims, but none of them is backed by any reference.

The text you removed says:

S.S. Lazio (1910)<ref>S.S. Lazio was founded in 1900 as a road racing society.[2] Only in 1902 Lazio played its first football matches, and only in 1910 the football division was officially created, after the Roman Football Club had already been founded in 1901. Thus the claim that Lazio brought football in Rome is wrong, as well as the claim that Lazio was the first Roman football team. (Fontanelli, Carlo, and Simona Carboncini, I colori del calcio, Geo Edizioni)</ref>.

Show why this text is wrong, providing references for your claims, or, please, avoid removing it. Note also that you reverted the text already four times in less than 24, which is against the WP:3RR.--BaldClarke 14:16, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Flags

I removed the flags from the list of players. The players are sorted by nationality, so there is no point in adding the flags in front of them, even if other articles do the same.--BaldClarke 11:29, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Former players are not ordered by nationality, so there is no reason in deleting the flags next to their names. Furthermore every article about football teams has the flags near players' names, so why delete them? Why delete informations? Gaúcho

Really? As for the current version, the order is Albania, Argentina, Brazil, France, Japan, Germany, Italy... Reverted.--BaldClarke 18:37, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

And so? ... Every article about football teams has the flags near players' names, so why delete them? Why delete informations? Gaúcho

And so you claimed "Former players are not ordered by nationality, so there is no reason in deleting the flags next to their names", and I proved you wrong. You now claim "Every article about football teams has the flags near players' names", and I told you that a bad behaviour is not corrected by another one. It is pointless to add the flags when the players are ordered by nationality. I expect you to revert to the flagless version. And note that you are on the verge of breaking the WP:3RR. Thanks.--BaldClarke 00:42, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Protected

I've protected this page until the edit warring stops. Please work out your differences here and come to a consensus. Thanks. --Kbdank71 20:12, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

In my last change I added the flags next to the names of the countries, not to the players' ones; I also added a note, but probably BaldClark reverted it without noting it... Gaúcho

Flags next to the nation's names? Even more useless.--BaldClarke 10:49, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Who has decided that it's useless? You did, not Wikipedia... if you would see some articles in which there is a name of a country, near it there is always its own flag... So, when will you begin to delete every little flag you will see? Gaúcho

I am not sure your line of thinking is so smart: "Who has decided that it's useless? You did, not Wikipedia..." can be easily reverted to "Who has decided that it's useful? You did, not Wikipedia...", but it would be childish and not definitive, as a way to settle the matter. So I am asking you, what is the point to put the flag of Italy next to the word "Italy", used as a section title, in bold and alone? My answer is none, so I consider it useless. If you are able to show me why it is useful, I will accept the reintroduction of the flags, otherwise I wil remove them.--BaldClarke 14:41, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

I told YOU have decided that it's useless, because in every en.wiki article in which there is a name of a country, near it you can see its own flag. Here below I wrote a short list of articles for you, so you can check and (I hope) understand wikipedia's policy about flags. Arab League, Community of Portuguese Language Countries, FIFA World Cup, List of foreign Serie A players, Olympic Games, Pope Benedict XVI Islam controversy.

If you don't agree with me I think you should start to delete every flag from everyone of these articles... Gaúcho

This is what I am planning to do, if/when I find article that have the same problem. Thanks.--BaldClarke 15:40, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

...poraccio... honestly, tell me, have you got some problems with flags? Are you scared of them? Maybe when you were child you thought they were ghosts and now you hate them?!? OK, if it's like this I offer myself to help you to solve your frustrations... Gaúcho

poraccio ce sarai te, che nun sai manco come te chiami.--BaldClarke 10:00, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

ahahah! ...poraccio... aó, occhio si vvai a vvia der Corzo che llà è ppieno de fantasmi che svolazzano, te potrebbe pijà 'na crisi! Gaúcho

The inaccuracies regarding Lazio's foundation date purported by BaldClarke in the main article is another issue which I would appreciate being addressed while we're at it. It is well-known fact that Lazio was founded in 1900, that the football section was added in 1901 and that it started playing matches in 1902. This claim can easily be corroborated by a neutral and reliable source like Panini's Almanacco del Calcio, yet BaldClarke continues to misleadingly insist on using 1910 (?!) as the actual foundation date and quotes sources without providing anything concrete to back his claim up. Any subsequent changes which rectify the erroneous claim are dismissed by using the three revert rule. In other words, one can go around Wikipedia editing articles to one's liking and claim that users who correct disinformation are actually at fault because of 3RR. This is simply unacceptable.

My dear unknown user,

understanding English is a prerequisite of contributing to English Wikipedia. This capability would have let you understand that the article claims that Lazio was founded in 1900, that some matches were played among Lazio members in 1902 (possibly in 1903), but that a football section partecipating to an official tournament is recorded only in 1910.

Until somebody comes with a proof of an official tournament played by a football section of S.S. Lazio before 1910, the text must stay that way, not for WP:3RR, but for Wikipedia:Verifiability.

I hope you understood this message, so that I will be not obliged to write it again and again.--BaldClarke 15:40, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

You know just as well as I do that you are being deliberately misleading by using that 1910 date as you have in the main article.

This 1910 date which you have pulled out of a hat is not a reference to a tournament, but in actual fact to when the Italian FA began officially recognizing championships in central southern Italy for all teams, including lesser ones like Roman and Fortitudo. If that is the approach you want to use, you will have to use exactly the same date (1910) with the other teams mentioned in the article. It is chronologically impossible to claim that a team like Lazio, which was the most dominant one in Rome, started to play in official league championships after everyone else!?

Bear in mind that your sources are the ones that need to be verified as you are the one that is making a claim that by all accounts is completely unheard of. Ellipsis4677 19:13, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Can you read? my source is Fontanelli, Carlo, and Simona Carboncini, I colori del calcio, Geo Edizioni.--BaldClarke 10:00, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Look at the SS Lazio official website; there is a page dedicated to the team history [3], where it's explicitly stated that Lazio as "società podistica" was founded on "9th of January, 1900", and started football activities in 1902. Never cited 1910 in this page. I hope you understand Italian in order to read it, but I think you do, since you're citing an Italian-language book. And your claim that, since football divisions started in 1910, therefore Lazio's foundation year must be considered as 1910, is completely wrong. In fact, should it be true, all scudetti assigned before 1910 would not be valid, and we all should impose 1910 as foundation year for teams such as AC Milan, Juventus, Genoa and Inter. --Angelo 11:08, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Even Angelo romano, an etablished Wikipedian who I don't think can be suspected of having sympathies for Lazio, easily debunked your reasoning above. In addition, you have put your own foot in your mouth as you yourself refer to foundation dates in the same line when referring to lesser clubs like Alba and Audace! If that is indeed what we are talking about, and I believe that it is, Lazio's is 1900 - whether you like it or not and regardless of whichever you will attempt to use Wikipedia to disinform others. Oh yeah, be careful, you're almost out of line when it comes to the 3 revert rule! :insertrolleyes:. Ellipsis4677 06:48, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

Nobody ever provided any reference to an official creation of a football section of S.S. Lazio before 1910. Note that "official football section" does not apply to some members of a podistic society that play football among them (and even that in 1902/03, not in 1900). I gave you a reference for my point.--BaldClarke 12:04, 11 October 2006 (UTC)

I hope that the Almanacco Panini is good enough for you? Speaking of references, where are yours on Roman FC? You state that it was 1901, but there is so little documentation on the club's beginnings that it would appear that you are pulling that one out of a hat as well. Just drop this business on the foundation dates because you know you are wrong. I suggest that we ask outside parties to have their say in case you'll insist on going on and on with this. Angelo romano already said what he thought, maybe we can find someone else?Ellipsis4677 11:41, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Almanacco Panini does not say the football club was officially created in 1900, does it?

As regards Roman FC, my source was stated in the footnote, before someone deleted it, and is Fontanelli, Carlo, and Simona Carboncini, I colori del calcio, Geo Edizioni.

I would accept third parties, but they should be unbiased and research through this matter. Simply checking Lazio website would result in a claim for a foundation in 1900, which is clearly wrong (I am referring to the football club, of course).--BaldClarke 11:51, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

Almanacco Panini says that Lazio was founded in 1900 and football was being played as of 1901. You find a source that debunks that. Remember you are making an extraordinary claim, therefore the burden is on you to provide the evidence. I really would like to see this obscure book you keep on quoting!? My source (Almanacco del Calcio) is easily available in any book store and has backed up everything I've said so far.

What I find interesting is your deliberate and deceiving use of double-standards. On the one hand you continue to claim that Lazio's only possible foundation date is 1910 because that is when the club allegedly played in official tournaments for the first time, a statement which is clearly false and has already been debunked, yet at the same time you use the alleged foundation date of Roman FC to make your point, in the loosest sense of the word, that Lazio was not Rome's "first" team. What are we talking about here? When the team was founded or when it started playing tournaments? In either case you lose, because it is common knowledge that Lazio was the first team to play in Rome, and there is no concrete evidence proving Roman FC's foundation date, let alone whether they even played football in the beginning, and that this 1910 date which you continuously refer to is an erroneous reference (it was actually 1912) to when the Italian FA started recognizing and organizing teams in the center and south of Italy into official championships. Therefore, as Angelo Romano said, if 1910 is Lazio's foundation date, then so is every other team's in the region. Ellipsis4677 13:49, 12 October 2006 (UTC) Ellipsis4677 13:49, 12 October 2006 (UTC)

I changed the connection of AS Roma foundation with fascist regime because there is not any evidence of a political willing. Many clubs of center and south merged to become professional and competitive; in 1926 Fiorentina, Bari e Napoli were founded and so Roma in 1927. Basicly it was an economic need.

There is not any evidence about a political willing to create a club named Roma in serie A. Moreover Mussolini's sons were lazio supporters and lazio executive Vaccaro, who fought the merger and was Football association important member, was a fascist militia chief.

moreover i don't think that ss lazio activities and foundation is relevant in this page