Talk:Alice Paul

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Regarding the National Woman's Party:

It really was called that, though "women's" might seem more correct today. It deserves its own article RSN, too. toh 08:47, 2004 Oct 29 (UTC) loves men

Contents 1 Paul? 2 Abortion Views 3 Iron Jawed Angels 4 First civil disobedience? 5 Alice paul the racist? 6 abortion views edit

[edit] Paul?

Would anyone object to the use of "Alice" instead of "Paul" when referring to her by one name in the article? However silly it might seem to the sentient beings among us, it's surely confusing for some people that the latter is a man's name, especially if they've followed a link and are skimming the article for something specific. Kaz 17:06, 10 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I agree that in this case, the use of her last name may be somewhat confusing. However, it is the style in which Wikipedia articles are generally written. Could we not assume that the reader has enough intelligence to figure it out? We could use both names, at times, in the article to try to make it clearer. Sunray 20:02, 2005 Feb 10 (UTC)

I've added Alice or Ms. in some cases to (hopefully) make it more understandable. I'm reluctant to do this too much for the reason given above (i.e., it is more encyclopedic to use the last name). Sunray 22:14, 2005 Feb 10 (UTC)

I agree with the editor who removed the "Ms"...it's a good idea in theory, but I'm not sure "Ms" even existed back then, and I think using Mr/Mrs/Miss/Ms might even be less encyclopedic than using her first name. Kaz 15:31, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Agreed. As you will note from the article page history, t'was I who removed them—just didn't look right. Sunray 16:38, 2005 Feb 11 (UTC)

I encountered a scientific article in a periodical, today, which used the first name and last initial, in order to look officious without being too cumbersome. Perhaps that would work here, she could sometimes be referred to as Alice P. Kaz 19:10, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Miss Paul was her preferred callsign.

[edit] Abortion Views

Article sez:

Antibiotics were not available to treat infection until the 1930's and Paul thus reasoned that women should not have to endanger themselves with any surgery unless they had to.

Is this just speculation? Or is she on record as having said this? -- 69.181.74.76 19:15, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

Dunno. Antiobiotics weren't available until the 1940s, BTW. --M1ss1ontomars2k4 | T | C | @ 05:02, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Iron Jawed Angels

How accurate is the movie? Does anyone know? --M1ss1ontomars2k4 | T | C | @ 05:07, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

Not too bad, if I recall. Certainly no worse than most other history-derived movies. And it's often a good idea not to take them too seriously unless made specifically as a documentary.  — Anna Kucsma 15:13, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] First civil disobedience?

The article states: In January 1917, the NWP staged the first political protest ever to picket the White House. The pickets, known as "Silent Sentinels," held banners demanding the right to vote. This is believed to have been the first non-violent civil disobedience campaign in the U.S.

I suggest there were numerous non-violent civil disobedience campaigns prior to 1917. In Civil disobedience, the article notes that: In the (1849) essay, Thoreau explained his reasons for having refused to pay taxes as an act of protest against slavery and against the Mexican-American War. Because it is the action from which Thoreau wrote his famous essay, it is widely considered to be the origin of non-violent civil disobedience. It was certainly within the U.S. I would also consider the following as examples of non-violent civil disobedience campaigns: Underground Railroad, the Anti-Slavery Society, the Women's Rights Convention, the campaign for the 8-hour day, the whole labor movement of the late 19th Century, the 1913 Patterson Silk Strike.

Alice Paul deserves credit for the extent of her personal suffering for the causes of women's rights. However, I suggest deleting the sentence that says: This is believed to have been the first non-violent civil disobedience campaign in the U.S.

I would argue that the picketing of the White House ought not to be considered to have been civil disobedience, since it was not illegal (notwithstanding that Paul and her supporters were wrongfully imprisoned for it). This is not to deprecate the great courage of Paul et al.--Nate Levin

r3 00:35, 3 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Alice paul the racist?

I removed the following unsourced paragraph:

"Alice Paul was blatantly racist against African Americans and was also incredibly anti-Semetic. Said novelist Veronica Ross, "I saw the whole women's movement as racist. Having Alice Paul's name on the center was like hanging a confederate flag on the door." Although she was partly responsible for the women's suffrage, one cannot overlook the racism. The real question is; how can someone be hypocrital enough to propose an "Equal Rights Amendment" while being a racist? Alice Paul is over-rated."

Not only is this paragraph far from NPOV, it is also unsourced. I removed it. If the author finds a source and a NPOV way to rewrite it, please feel free to put it back in.spirit 02:23, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] abortion views edit

If no one minds, I cut "clearly she does not care about males and thus cannot ask for equal rights if she refuses to recognize abortion as the killing of males as well as,and not just, women," because that is judgement, not information. Besides, commas are used incorrectly. 138.26.94.37 21:23, 6 March 2007 (UTC)