Talk:Atherosclerosis

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Some of the text on this page has been taken from the public domain document at http://www.4woman.gov/faq/atheroscle.htm

Cellular Atherogenesis; The first and secound paragraphs should be swapped around as the initial damage occurs (2nd para) and then foramtion of fatty streaks occur (1st para). As it stands it could create confusion that fatty streak formation precedes the inflammation response and formation of foam cells.

Contents 1 Arteriosclerosis / Atherosclerosis 2 References 3 Patent as a source 4 Astroid studies? 5 Prevention 6 Atheroma vs. Atherosclerosis 7 The Plaque 8 CFTR gene variations susceptible

[edit] Arteriosclerosis / Atherosclerosis

As described here here, and here, Arteriosclerosis / Atherosclerosis are not the same. Arteriosclerosis is the more general term describing many diseases involving the cardiovascular system and its associated arteries and vessels which go along with it. Atherosclerosis is a term used to describe diseases that affect the vessel walls, in other words, "hardening of the arteries". Therefore Arteriosclerosis should not be redirected to Atherosclerosis, but a better idea would be to create an individual article for Arteriosclerosis. Would it be best to create two seperate articles for this purpose? --Bryan986 05:40, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I'd recommend two different articles, with a note at top of each linking to the other. --Arcadian 22:32, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

As a temporary measure, I've added the following paragraph: Some sources draw a distinction between "Arteriosclerosis", "Atherosclerosis", and "Arteriolosclerosis". In these contexts, "Atherosclerosis" is used when referring to larger arteries, and "Arteriolosclerosis" is used when referring to arterioles, with "Arteriosclerosis" used as a parent of both terms. --Arcadian 23:50, 2 November 2005 (UTC)

I think you'll find "Arteriosclerosis", is by definition, a hardening (and loss of elasticity) of the artery (in Latin, Arterio meaning artery and sclerosis meaning hardening), "Atherosclerosis" is an artery hardened by an atherosclerotic plaque (in Latin Athero means porrige-like) and "Arteriolosclerosis" is by definition, Arteriosclerosis mainly affecting the arterioles. Therefore, Atherosclerosis is a condition symptomatic of, and a form of, arteriosclerosis and artiolosclerosis. Please change your article so it makes this clear. -- Rutigor 21:00 GMT, 26/12/05

Arcadian's temporary paragraph (see above) replaced with a new paragraph using the phrasing provided by Rutigor to improve clarity and accuracy. --68.162.219.226 14:24, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] References

These references could not be traced back to information in the article:

• Steven Nissen: Atherosclerosis Development, Clinical Cardiology Vol 27 (Suppl IV), 17-20, July 2004
• Peter Libby: Atherosclerosis: The New View, Scientific American Vol 286, No. 5, May 2002

The Libby article is a good overview, but perhaps a more scholary source would be better to explain the inflammation - atherosclerosis link. JFW | T@lk 22:48, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

Here is the Libby article in PDF. JFW | T@lk 22:51, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Patent as a source

I strongly oppose moves by WetBandit (talk • contribs) to link to a patent owned by Rath and Pauling (U.S. Patent 5,278,189 ) with regards to vitamin C. There are much better sources for this information - a patent is a secondary source which contains legal, not medical proof. The patent identifies Rath & Pauling as owners of the intellectual property, but does not itself provide proof of the clinical efficacy of vitamin C in atherosclerosis. I have asked WetBandit for a better source, with reinsertion of the patent in response. Does Anyone else have views on this? JFW | T@lk 10:12, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

agree with jfdwolff. citation should be a primary source. Anlace 23:04, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Astroid studies?

MAlvis, can you clarify for us what you were referring to in your edit summary when you mentioned (an) Asteroid study? I can't find anything to do with that in the actual article? Was that referring to several articles? Thanks Dieter Simon 17:09, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

I am sorry, but there is only one reference to the Asteroid trial which in the article only once refers to "the Asteroid trial..."

"The ASTEROID trial, mentioned above and in reference 3, has been the first to show actual disease volume regression, however, by design, was not large enough and long enough to statistically "prove" the mortality reduction issue. The trials to test this issue with this agent are currently in progress; all current evidence and signs are that the outcomes will be very favorable."

The ASTEROID study had no placebo group, could not prove clinical benefit and used a drug dose Health Canada issued a caveat about, i.e rosuvastatin a.k.a Crestor 40 mg. Crestor trials have never included a significant placebo group to show if the drug harms or benefits anyone over placebo. It likely causes a massive reduction in CoQ10 and may seriously harm those with heart failure and promote muscle and nerve damage. I propose any reference to ASTEROID be removed: it showed a volume reduction but gave no clue as to if the artery became stronger or weaker, it simply became thinner, as did the lumen, the opening for blood flow [picture on page 8]. Eddie at: vos@health-heart.org

Can you point us to the relevant prior section, because I can't find it. Dieter Simon 23:40, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

Don't get me wrong, I really do admire the article, it is extremely informative, just if you could clear up that point for us. Dieter Simon 11:23, 31 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Prevention

I'd be really interested in seeing a section on prevention, information on how to make healthier choices to minimize atherosclerosis.

There are 2 subjects here:

1. how to prevent structural decline of the artery and I propose that 'corrosion' of relevant proteins is caused by homocysteine, a general protein corrosive [reduced by 1/2 dozen B vitamins or once called vitamins] and by similar 'glycation' caused be excess blood sugar in diabetes. These are the 2 main causal factors in protein decline, including the artery. Moreover, homocysteine promotes cell migration and clotting.

2. how to prevent heart attack and dying thereof once structural / architectural decline of the artery wall is present, something the age-old International Atherosclerosis Project showed is the case in vertually all individuals from all regions examined. Pre-fatal fibrillation may be reduced or prevented by adequate electrolyte [arguably most relevant being magnesium] status, and certainly both the plant omega-3 found in canola, flax and soy oils, and the longer chain omega-3's found in any fish oil [studies: Lyon Diet Heart, and GISSI].

Statin drugs are used in such prevention strategy but they are not approved for such purpose in most countries: FDA approval only covers 'dyslipidemia' treatment; same in Canada. One of their side effects, even in low-dose, is mimicking nitroglycerin via the NO-synthase pathway, and they have mild antiinflammatory roles. In either department we have approved and safe alternatives without the side effects, cost and lack of mortality or effecacy benefit that statins suffer from and where heart attack and mortality benefit is simply absent in women of any age. Eddievos 13:59, 25 December 2006 (UTC) Eddie at: vos@health-heart.org

[edit] Atheroma vs. Atherosclerosis

I find the information presented in this article and in atheroma to be quite redundant and the distinction between the two topics is not clear to me. What are the non-atheroma aspects of atherosclerosis? If atheromas are one of the symptoms of atherosclerosis, then this article says very little on the other aspects. It seems a good amount of the information here should move to the atheroma article. This article ought to give a higher level view of atherosclerosis that includes a summary on atheroma formation (with a "for more information see the article on atheroma" link ), and focus more on the disease aspects. --128.36.196.58 16:22, 12 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The Plaque

In all textbooks I've come across, the fibrous cap is considered part of the plaque.

[edit] CFTR gene variations susceptible

as conductance of membranes is one of anatomical features of artery , why not dig also around this gene? 83.12.255.234 22:22, 26 February 2007 (UTC)