Talk:Avocado

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Contents 1 Avocado oil 2 Fruit type 3 Fat 4 Hass vs. Haas 5 avocado gone bad? 6 Origin of avocados in the USA 7 Toxicity 8 Fruit? 9 Sex of tree 10 protein content 11 maturity 12 Spelling 13 Species 14 Irrigation water 15 houseplant 16 More expensive? 17 Determining ripeness? 18 Yoon and name 19 Pre-Columbian cultivation history needed 20 Interesting facts

[edit] Avocado oil

Importance of avocado oil, extraction and medicinal use.

I seemed to remember something about steroids & avocados, and a quick google brought up this article:

Cosmetic ingredients | Oils & Butters

which includes some interesting information... --Spiggot 20:17, 1 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Fruit type

An avocado is a drupe, right? (I just learned that word, having discovered it in another wikipedia article.)

At first glance it appears so, but because the endocarp (the thin coating around the seed) is soft and thin, it's called a berry. I have an explanatory link that I'll add to the article's External links section. - toh 19:46, 2005 Feb 10 (UTC)

Well, this may be the case, but the Drupe article says Avocados are Drupes. Someone who knows for sure ought to fix the situation. Solemnavalanche 23:15, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

It's gotta be a berry: drupes are more like peaches or almonds, with a fleshy outer layer, then a hard kernel, then a seed inside. It's not really relevant how hard the skin is: if there's no hard kernel layer, it's not a drupe. Watermelons are berries.Clickie 06:05, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

The berry article also says avocados are berries. I vote for a drupe, however, as the avocado is similar to other drupes, such as the olive, which is one of the few other fruits with a substantial fat content. StuRat 00:50, 18 August 2005 (UTC)

I agree, but we should check in a botany book. I would say drupe because the avocado seed has the hardened endocarp common to drupes; whether or not this is from the ovary wall is the real question. This college taxonomy course identifies avocados as drupes. --Mgreenbe 09:31, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

Searching google for avacado and drupe yeilds 206 results vs 17200 for avacado and berry. On this basis, I vote berry! --Username132 16:01, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

I don't think it's a matter of a vote or Google results, but rather one of a hardened endocarp. The Persea page claims that this genus of laurels produces drupes exclusively, but I can't find a source on-line. I'll run to the biology library on Wednesday and find out. --Mgreenbe 16:43, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Checked a couple of botanical texts, and both said 'berry or drupe', so I guess it doesn't matter. Presumably it depends on the question, how hard does an endocarp have to be, to be called "hard"? It is certainly present, and hardish, but not very hard, in an avocado. - MPF 19:13, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Fat

At one point the article states that avocados are high in monounsaturated fats, then later, that they contain a lot of saturated fat. Is this contradictory? Joyous 16:16, Oct 30, 2004 (UTC)

Theoretically they could be high in both (and low in polyunsaturated fat), but it appears to have been an error; most of the fat is monounsaturated (if squeezed from the flesh, it will remain liquid at room temperature). Someone else has already corrected the error. - toh 19:46, 2005 Feb 10 (UTC)

[edit] Hass vs. Haas

Are you sure that hass is so wrong? It's named after Rudolph Haas, a La habra Heights postal worker who patented the variety in 1935.

Even if it's common to spell it Hass, it's hardly correct to say that Haas is wrong.

In any case, this info should probably make it's way into the article.

True that google hits isn't always reliable evidence, but entering ["Rudolph Hass" avocado] gets 108 hits, while ["Rudolph Haas" avocado] only gets two, which seems quite conclusive. I used to think 'Haas' was correct, but the details I've seen on investigating all point to 'Hass' being correct - MPF 09:59, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Well, every time I'm in a grocery store, the label says "Hass". So I'm suspicious that Haas would be correct. It just seems unlikely to me that a misspelling would be so rampant among grocers, who presumably get the spelling from the growers. --Chan-Ho (Talk) 07:27, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

The Calfornia Avocado Commission spells it "Hass" on its website [1] and identifies the owner of the Hass Mother Tree as Rudolph Hass [2]. A Google search for "Hass avocado" gets over 29,000 results and "Haas avocado" gets less than 1,000, a ratio of nearly 30 to 1. Nohat 09:49, 14 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] avocado gone bad?

Some guidance on telling when an avocado is ripe would be useful. And is it safe to eat once the inside has gone dark?

[edit] Origin of avocados in the USA

The article says "Avocados are much more expensive in the USA than other countries due to the fact that they grow almost exclusively in California and Florida, and the main potential competitor (Mexico) is largely banned from the market".

I know from personal experience that Mexican avocados can indeed be found in grocery stores in the US. Does that mean that this ban is over? I don't have any hard data, though. Itub 22:01, 22 September 2005 (UTC)

Avocado from Mexico were allowed in the US market from October 15th to April 15 only in 31 states. In 2005, the USDA aproved avocados from Mexico to 47 states (not in FL, CA, HI) year round. In 2007 avocados will be in the 50 states year round.

[edit] Toxicity

It's worth mentioning that avocados are toxic to many pets (e.g. dogs, cats and birds especially). The leaves and pits of the avocado tree may be toxic to humans as well.

Yes! I didn't know that. I'll remember that money saving tip when it's time to put Sabre down... Work it into the article somewhere --Username132 16:01, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

It's also worth mentioning that some dog foods are made with avocados. I am not sure it is reliable to say avocado fruit is toxic to dogs. Does anyone have a source for this assertion? It is safer to say some dogs may be allergic to the avocado fruit. The same may be said for cats, but I haven't looked into it.
http://www.breeders-choice.com/dog_products/avodermdog_veg.htm
Leon F. Whitney, The Complete Book of Dog Care. Revised ed. (New York: Doubleday, 1985), pp. 38-40.
--Scot.hale@gmail.com 21:28, 13 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Fruit?

Why not vegetable?--Nixer 20:27, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

See fruit and vegetable for the answer. -GTBacchus^(talk) 20:51, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Sex of tree

It is worth mentioning that the Avocado trees exist in two sexes: A and B and both must be present in order for the flowers to pollinate and produce fruit planting guide. Because all of the breeds (varieties) currently available are clones of the origional tree of that breed, they are all the same sex and thus, for example, all Hass Avocados are sex A and all Bacon Avocados are sex B.

Avocado trees actually change reproductive sex mid-day. Depending on the tree's sex (A or B), it will be male in the morning and female in the afternoon, or vice-versa, on alternating days.

Preceeding unsigned comments added by User:68.54.34.194 at 16:49 on 28 December 2005

Following comments added to article page by User:219.88.216.162 at 03:34 on 29 December 2005

The avocado is unusual in that the timing of the male and female phases differs among varieties. There are two flowering types, referred to as "A" and "B" flower types. "A" varieties open as female on the morning of the first day. The flower closes in late morning or early afternoon. The flower will remain closed until the afternoon of the second day when it opens as male. "B" varieties open as female on the afternoon of the first day, close in late afternoon and re-open in the male phase the following morning.

"A" Varieties: Hass, Gwen, Lamb Hass, Pinkerton, Reed.

"B" Varieties: Fuerte, Sharwil, Zutano, Bacon, Ettinger, Sir Prize, Walter Hole.

This is sufficiently unusual to require references for verification - I find it hard to trust when the additions also fail to use standard terminology (e.g. saying "variety" rather than 'cultivar') - MPF 09:12, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

Note that the California Avocado Commission Uses the term "variety" to describe this fruit. See [3] LexieM 21:35, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

I Am providing refrences here: [4] (see horticulture section), [5] (section on polination and table 1). This is an important and unusual phenomenon in avacado plants, and should be in the article. I am returning it to the article. LexieM 21:40, 28 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] protein content

from NATS the following % protein accounts for water content:

spinach   3%
broccoli  3%
mushroom  2%
avocado   2%
lettuce   1%

[edit] maturity

can someone post the time it takes to mature/the life cycle? Dread Lord CyberSkull ✎☠ 04:52, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

Here is a refrence to use: "Grafted trees begin to produce on a commercial scale after 3 to 4 years. In Florida, yields from mature trees average 2 to 3 bushels per year (110 to 165 lbs; 50 to 75 kg). However, with good management, considerably better production can be expected." [6] 69.171.150.47 18:24, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Spelling

I misspelled a link as "avacado," and did not notice because the redirect took the link to the correct page. That resulted in another page having a spelling error that would have been immediately noticed if the redirect had not existed. Can we get rid of the "avacado" redirect? --Darksasami 19:29, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

Sure, I agree that's not a common enough misspelling that we need a redirect. (We do have at least 1,420 redirects from misspellings.) -GTBacchus^(talk) 19:40, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

I had never seen that misspelling before, but a google search suggests that it is more common than I imagined: about 1 million hits for "avacado" vs 13 million for "avocado". I think the redirect should stay. Itub 15:22, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

I constantly make that spelling error, since that's the way I pronounce it. StuRat 01:31, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Species

Not only Persea and P. americana are called avocado. See [7]

[edit] Irrigation water

Explain or delete:

Yield is reduced when the irrigation water has a high electrical conductivity.

Jclerman 11:30, 27 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] houseplant

I have one seed of avocado which germinated and produced a green-leavish plant. I am keeping it not in full light of sun, but in a condition of diffused light. Is it better to put it directly under the sun? Will it grow faster or that is different from the expected growing environment? Thanks! --Cantalamessa 14:32, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

I think direct sunlight is best, yes. StuRat 01:23, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] More expensive?

I find it difficult to believe that "Avocados are much more expensive in the USA than other countries." They might be cheaper in poorer countries (as is most food), but in comparable (e.g., G7) countries? At any time of year I can get tiny avocados for 20 cents each. At some times of year I can get medium ones for 30. Most of the time, large ones are between 1 and 2 dollars. Is there any source for this claim? Calbaer 01:26, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

They cost $1-$1.50 in the Detroit area, which does seem like quite a bit compared to, say bananas, at 3 pounds for $1. Avocados were maybe half as much in Los Angeles. StuRat 01:28, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

In Australia (an avocado growing area) supermarket prices vary between 80 US Cents to $2.00 US (at current exchange rates). Often available 'on clearance' at farm gates and local fruit stores for about 50 cents. (Michael from Queensland 20 March 2007)

In Connecticut the Hass avocados usually cost $2.00 USD each, although sometimes you can find them a bit cheaper, especially if you buy a bag with several. For comparison, in Switzerland, a famously expensive country, you usually find them for about 1.50 CHF, which is about $1.20 USD. So yes, I believe that there is some truth to the claim. Of course, this is just personal experience, so I'm afraid I don't have a citable source. --Itub 08:21, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

I understand that they are supposed to be hella expensive this summer because of the crops were destroyed. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Dougieb (talk • contribs) 01:56, 21 March 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Determining ripeness?

Perhaps this is outside the scope of Wikipedia, but I would find it very useful if someone could add an explanation to the article as to how to determine whether an avocado is ripe or not. Avocados have a relatively short window between being unripe and overripe - I know that I can never seen to figure out whether one is ripe or not until I cut it open, after which, it's too late. I would suppose that other people would find this information useful as well. cbustapeck 20:42, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

A ripe Hass avocado has a black skin and feels slightly soft. You can increase the "ripeness window" to several days by keeping it refrigerated, or you can make it ripen faster by keeping it in a warm place. Itub 21:58, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

I suggest buying them rock hard, then refrigerate immediately. Whenever I buy one even slightly soft, most of it seems to be rotten. StuRat 01:19, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Refrigerating an avocado stops the ripening process, which is okay if the fruit is already ripe, but counter-productive if it's not. A Hass avocado will get slightly softer and darker as it ripens, so examining the range of colours in the market might give you some help. According to Good Eats host Alton Brown, a good indicator of ripeness is the flesh underneath the tiny stem nub at the end of the fruit - if it's green the fruit is probably either ripe or almost ripe. Here's a transcript. Matt Deres 20:03, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

What are the black strings that run through a ripe avocado and are they harmful to ingest?

[edit] Yoon and name

I put back in the information about the name that comes from the NPR story. Please don't delete it. --Gbleem 02:21, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

I just have. That NPR stuff isn't a reliable source, and is POV to the USA without any consideration of global usage. - MPF 14:13, 6 November 2006 (UTC)

It's too bad Yoon got some of it wrong because I think the changes in the marketing of the fruit in the US probably has a place in the article if there is a better source. --Gbleem 12:02, 10 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pre-Columbian cultivation history needed

this article doesn't appear to have any information on the fruit's use by pre-Columbian Mexicans, the people who presumably first cultivated it. The history stuff just starts off with when Europeans first heard about it, which seems a little unbalanced. So when was it first culivated? and whereabouts in mezoamerica and by what groups specifically? --Krsont 18:36, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

If you can find out, please add the information! - MPF 22:38, 8 November 2006 (UTC)

It was probably in all the books the Spanish burned because they thought they were satanic. --Gbleem 11:51, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Interesting facts

I personally find some of these hard to believe, and since I am only slightly unique, I figure other people would too. Particularly the 'locking up Aztec virgins during harvesting' and the 'growers had to dissociate the fruit from sex'.. MGlosenger 02:10, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Yup, it's true! Check it! Check it! yo! * All About Avocados, History of Avocados, History of Haas Avocado The timeline on this page is pretty interesting. There are lots of resources on the web and elsewhere for this type info on our Avocado :-D Dougieb 07:04, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Huh, I never would have guessed. Cool. Still nothing about the Azteca virgins though. MGlosenger 07:09, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Damn... it's always the VIRGINS! (LOL)... Yes, you are right. Well, I imagine that is where the guacamole and tequila came in, but no matter - a citation you shall have! Dougieb 09:39, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Works for me. Now that I know about the magical powers of avocados, I'll be having sexual intercourse over and over and over. MGlosenger 10:15, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

Not with Virgins though, because they are not outside (LOL)Dougieb 10:41, 20 December 2006 (UTC)