Talk:Backhoe
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[edit] how to operate?
I have looked all over, I would think somewhere on the internet is how to operate one... perhaps a java based game? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by by 134.114.104.43 (talk • contribs) 2 February 2006 (UTC)
- There's a flash-based simulator approximately here, from the last page of the howstuffworks article now linked to from our page. (Disclaimer: it doesn't work for me, perhaps because it's Windows-only.) —Steve Summit (talk) 00:43, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
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- There's also a VRML-based one at http://cic.nist.gov/vrml/equip.html. —Steve Summit (talk) 01:17, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Suggested Link
I was wondering if people would be interested in placing a link to [http://earlyhistory.googlepages.com/historyoftheearlybackhoe History of the Early Backhoe]? Please explain your reasoning as to why or why not. Thanks! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by West wikipedia (talk • contribs) 18:29, 9 December 2006 (UTC).
- Because it does not cite it's sources, doesn't add anything already in Wikipedia, the site is non-notable i.e. it hasn't been cited as an authority by other reliable sources and it's authors are completely unknown. In fact if I google for earlyhistory googlepages com I get nothing. Please read WP:WEB (under criteria), WP:RS (e.g. Non-scholarly sources) and WP:NOTABLE and ideally please solve this one link first before you start posting to all the other entries you've been trying to make. Ttiotsw 18:51, 9 December 2006 (UTC)
- Not to mention that here we are only two days later and the suggested link http://earlyhistory.googlepages.com/historyoftheearlybackhoe is already dead. —Steve Summit (talk) 00:00, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Backhoe = forkcrane
In Japan, and Korea I'm told, backhoes are referred to as 'forkcranes'.
[edit] Suggested merge
I propose merging Backhoe fade into the main backhoe article. "Backhoe fade" is a narrowly-used neologism. I do think it warrants a mention here, but not its own article. Rather than nominating it for deletion as I was originally going to do, I thought I would suggest a merge first. Kafziel 14:48, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Poll
- Merge, as nominator. Kafziel 14:50, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
- Merge, also include usage of the derogatory appellation "Backhoe Joe", referring to the guy who just caused the cable cut. Extremely frequently in the US this is used ("Backhoe Joe's at it again") when a carrier loses one of it's lines in an unexpected and mysterious manner, even if the issue has not been isolated to be a cable cut via earth moving equipment. Cheez0r 23:07, 15 September 2006 (UTC)
- Oppose -- While the name contains the word "backhoe", the phenomenon isn't limited to just backhoes. Atlant 01:28, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
- When the article was started (by you), it was just a redirect to JC Bamford. How is that any different than a redirect to backhoe? You were right in thinking that it wasn't notable enough for its own article. What changed? Kafziel 14:39, 9 September 2006 (UTC)
- Oppose - Its not really so much a neologism as it is jargon in the telecom & ISP industry. Salahx 17:55, 27 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Comments
Backhoe fade was deleted yesterday as being non-notable, etc. Unfortunately, when the merge was suggested, no {{mergeto}} banner was added to its page, so it was not obvious that a merge proposal was underway. I have managed to obtain the original page text and have extracted the minimal encyclopaedic content into a new section within backhoe. It seems to be a widely-used term in the industry, even if its etymology is 'humorous', and so is worth including here. A suitable cite has been found too.
The page backhoe fade has been created afresh as a redirect to the new section, since it is linked from elsewhere within WP.
EdJogg 14:06, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
[edit] definitive etymology?
As the article says, "Similar attachments for [other vehicles] are still called backhoes even though they are mounted on the front. This is because the name refers to the action of the shovel, not its location on the vehicle; a backhoe digs by drawing earth backwards, rather than lifting it with a forward motion". And personally, I completely agree with this on both points, but I'd like to find some really definitive historical sources explaining how the term arose. (This is for my own curiosity, and perhaps for the Etymology section at wikt:backhoe, not because I'm about to start slapping {{cite}} tags all over this article. But obviously anything I learn will be fodder for this article.)
My own hunch -- and this is what I'd really like to confirm, if it's true -- is that the term "backhoe" was coined in direct opposition to the older steam shovel. If you look at a picture of a steam shovel, such as this one of ours, or this cute one, or this classic one, you can pretty clearly see that the digging bucket faces up, and that the machine digs by lifting up and away. A backhoe, on the other hand, as we know digs by pulling down and back towards the machine. The fact that you don't see steam shovels -- or anything else with that same, old up-and-away action -- any more makes me suspect that the pull-down-and-towards action has been found to be much more effective. (But it had to await the development of modern hydraulics, because a cable-hauled backhoe wouldn't work nearly as well.)
Anyway, I suspect that the word "back" in the name "backhoe" was chosen specifically because of the back-towards-the-machine action, which was backwards from the way steam shovels worked. I suspect that the fact that backhoes are often mounted on the backs of tractors is a coincidence which had nothing to do with the term's coinage (though I could be wrong). But the web searches I've done to try to confirm these suspicions have come up dry.
If anyone can dig up any confirmation for any of this (and preferably more definitive than personal armchair speculation, which is all I've really been doing so far), I'd appreciate it.
(I've raised the same question at Wikipedia:Reference desk/Science, and I'll be checking for answers at both places.) —Steve Summit (talk) 00:25, 12 December 2006 (UTC)
- Interesting discussion, I'm curious too. I have nothing to add though, except that another name for "excavator" is "trackhoe". —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.112.143.42 (talk) 02:26, 13 December 2006 (UTC).
The most common backhoes, with a loader on the front, are often called backhoe-loaders Its still common to see tractors with smaller loaders and/or backhoes attached to them, but the common models used by cities and private contractors are pretty uniform in their specifications. I would suggest a specifications section, mentioning how they are all powered hydrologically, are four-wheel drive and have a bucket on the front with a capacity of one cubic yard. Also, perhaps something on usage. Backhoes are the most versatile machine used in construction, since they can dig small pipelines or foundations and load dump trucks efficiently. On any large job though, they are relegated to an all-purpose secondary role since they can't achieve the depth or width of an excavator or the loading speed of a front end loader. --troublefunk--
