Talk:Baybayin

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Was RA really the same or considered the same as the DA sound in pre-Hispanic Tagalog?

I'm not an expert but I'm think pre-Hispanic Tagalogs don't distinguish between the /da/ and the /ra/ sound. This ambiguity even exists to this day. Dumaraan is the more correct form although dumadaan is acceptable. We also have dumarating instead of dumadating. Dito and rito are also equivalent. Some other examples: nagdadasal/nagdarasal, dinadagdag/dinaragdag, dumadagsa/dumaragsa. --seav 15:32, Apr 15, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Proposed renaming

The Tagalog alphabet is a better and more familiar name, I believe, then Baybayin; for instance, it's the Unicode designation. I propose to move this article. Evertype 10:55, 2005 Mar 8 (UTC)

Baybayin or alibata is the term being used in the academe. Many Filipinos are familiar with this term. I think there is no such thing as Tagalog alphabet. Baybayin was used not only by the Tagalogs but other ethnic group as well. Although, the apperance and style differ from one group to another. The modern Philippine alphabet that is being used by all languages in the country is called Filipino alphabet, which uses the Latin letters. --Jojit fb 5 July 2005 05:32 (UTC)

I don't believe that is correct. The Philippine scripts include Tagalog, Tagbanwa, Buhud, and Hanunoo. I have more materials which use the term "Tagalog script" than "Baybayin". (I am fine with preferring "script" to "alphabet". This script was encoded in the Unicode Standard as Tagalog, and the experts who consulted with us did not prefer the term "Baybayin". Evertype July 5, 2005 15:27 (UTC)

Spaniards in the 16th century called it "Tagalog letters" even though it was used by other languages such as Ilokano and Bikolano. Baybayin was an old Tagalog term to refer to any writing system. On the other hand, alibata was a term used by Paul Versoza in 1939. In Philippine schools, alibata and baybayin are the most common terms used when referring to this script. Even in Google search, alibata and baybayin are more common than "Tagalog script" and "Tagalog alphabet". From the POV of Filipinos, they won't understand if you say the term "Tagalog script" or "Tagalog alphabet". They might confuse it with the modern Filipino alphabet. I might agree if we make a redirection pages for "Old Tagalog script" or "Old Tagalog alphabet" but the main article would still be "Baybayin". --Jojit fb 6 July 2005 05:19 (UTC)

Also, you may want to indicate in the article that some experts did not prefer the use of "Baybayin" as Unicode Standard. --Jojit fb 6 July 2005 05:29 (UTC)

[edit] Wrong Transcription

The sample transcription of "Wikipedia" into Baybayin is wrong. It reads: "Wi Ki Pi Di A" with a glottal stop on the final syllable "A". The final syllable ought to be "Ya". Boreanesia 22:10, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Tagalog script

The name Tagalog script is not' confined to the Unicode standard; it is quite common in materials in English and other languages (like Dutch for instance). In my opinion it is a more useful name than Baybayin or Alibata, both of which are "generic" terms which may have meaning to local speakers but have little international utility. The fact that the former means 'spelling' and the latter just 'alphabet' shows that they are generic terms. Whether the script is used for languages other than Tagalog is irrelevant; the Arabic script is used for Arabic, Persian, Urdu, Sindhi, Pashto, and many other languages. I find the reversion of my recent edit inappropriate, but thought I had better begin the discussion here. -- Evertype·✆ 18:08, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

The languages used for a script is relevant since they show the script's history. I think the name Tagalog script is inaccurate since it might give the wrong impression that this script originated from Tagalog speakers. Unlike with the Arabic script and the Latin alphabet, both of which have evidence that suggest that they originated from Arabic speakers and Latin speakers respectively, there is no evidence that suggest that Baybayin originated from Tagalog speakers. For all we know the script might have originated from speakers of the Kinaray-a language. 23prootie 14:48, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

Ooops! I found a site that implies a Tagalog origin [1], but I guess to be fair to the other languges, I think the name should stay.23prootie 17:26, 1 November 2006 (UTC)

As I said, the usual name for this script is Tagalog. I believe we should move this to Tagalog script; this term is not inaccurate. You have seen that it was first devised for that language; "fairness" to the other languages really isn't relevant. The most common English name should be preferred, not words in another language which mean 'spelling' or 'alphabet'. Can we agree? If not, I can propose the move and let the community decide. -- Evertype·✆ 10:48, 9 November 2006 (UTC)