Talk:Enterprise content management

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Contents 1 History of ECM 2 Source 3 Illustrations for the article 4 Suggestions for Extension of Article 5 Change of ECM definition 6 NPOV 7 Possible Copyright violation 8 Wikify 9 fix this article please or i will

[edit] History of ECM

Added maglish 19:14, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Source

Completely revised and expanded article on ECM based on this source:

http://www.project-consult.net/Files/ECM_Handout_english_SER.pdf

Sorry for the "bad English" - I am not a native speaker - corrections welcome.

Published on wikipedia under GNU by the author. The author has been member of the Board of Directors of AIIM international when AIIM launched their new mission and focus on ECM.

Kff 15:26, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Additional Source added: For the section on History - based entirely on the new article sourced at the bottom of this entry. Evolving Electronic Document Management Solutions: The Doculabs Report, Third Edition. Chicago: Doculabs, 2002.

maglish 19:14, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Illustrations for the article

I need some help to integrate the images as thumbs without uploading them again. The references to the images in the German wikipedia are at the appropriate positions in the article text. Thanks.

Kff 15:26, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Suggestions for Extension of Article

The information is quite good and surprisingly relevent considering the original publication dates.

As vice chair for AIIM in Europe the original author was involved in the creation and definition of ECM 213.39.191.209 08:02, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

I suppose that this supports the idea that the basics remain constant inspite of technology's changes.

The basic principles and the definition of ECM remained nearly the same for the last five years. 213.39.191.209 08:02, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

My thought upon reading this article was; Now that you've accumulated the information, what do you do about utilizing it for decision support and trend analysis?

Specifically, as I see things like wikis and ad hoc BPM systems gain traction in the enterprise, the reality of the Operations Dashboard becomes much more of a reality. The ability to show important business metrics in a fashion akin to the dashboard of ones vehicle is enticing for management. If you design information capture processes and store the information into a uniform repository, this real-time or near real time analysis is now possible.

Shouldn't the 'later stage' application of the collected information be discussed? Is it already discussed? If so, then it should get linked to the article...

me-g33k 09:41, 14 September 2005 (UTC)

@ me-g33k, hoping you visit this page again ...

Thanks for the compliments. The section about the three basic principles of ECM I published in the German issue of the ComputerWoche already in September 2001, the first version of the section about the ECM components I published in our Newsletter in December 2002. For the wikipedia article I only used those parts and facts where I believe that they will stay stable for the next years. The collected information represents as well the "official" point of view of AIIM (2003) and have been published in a lot of whitepapers.

My opinion is not to expand the article too much. If we start adding application oriented topics to the article it will be become much longer and it is already very long. For applications (and new terms and acronyms) I believe it is better to create articles of their own although these artciles always will be in the danger becoming some kind of "advertising". I would prefer to delete all information about companies and better link to the respective category in the open directory project.

Kind regards Kff 12:29, 14 September 2005 (UTC)

The section on products and trends needs some update 213.39.191.209 08:02, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Change of ECM definition

AIIM international has changed the definition of ECM twice this year. A history of the definitions can be found here: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diskussion:ECM-Definition This list is regurlarly updated. Kff 17:17, 17 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] NPOV

Reading through this article leads me to the belief that there is a Neutral Point of View issue, likely due to the fact that only one or two people have contributed the vast majority of the content. It's a good article, with lots of good information, and it presents certain views about the present and future which are clearly the author's opinion rather than absolute fact.

I'm here to learn about ECM, so I wouldn't want to be the one to try and clean it up. Holding off on putting the NPOV flag onto it for now.

Biologic

ECM is an umbrella for a lot of trends, strategies, products, methods, and technologies. There are in fact no real "facts". Most of the text is the position of AIIM and available on the web, in posters, as articles, in books, in seminars, as CompTIA CDIA+ certificate, and even in ISO standards. The NPOV question can only be applied to the last section referring to companies who sell products for ECM.

80.171.50.165 09:37, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

Hello Biologic,

Most of the contribution was authored by me except the first introductory paragraph and the section "ECM market development". I left these parts of the original article unchanged. My text follwos the outline provided by AIIM international, the association representing most of the vendors and some thousand users of ECM. The article is to give an overview about the major strategies and the components of ECMS solutions. It mirrors the general market perception of this acronym. There are trade shows, conferences, books, articles, seminars, certification programs, standards, roadshows and a lot of more material giving the same view on the topic. I believe this contribution is no NPOV at all (except perhaps the section "ECM market development". In the German Wikipedia lists of vendors or future trends are unusual, but I have seen similar collections and texts on the English wikipedia). To cry out "NPOV" and in the same sentence to declare that you are not going to edit this contribution ist not the common way on Wikipedia.

Kind regards,

Kff 13:22, 21 September 2005 (UTC)

direct quotations from the whitepaper made visible italic.

No NPOV at all 213.39.191.209 08:04, 6 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Possible Copyright violation

Removed. The article was released by the original author. 213.39.198.87 10:14, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Wikify

I wikify tagged this article because it is poorly formatted, horribly long and jargon-ish Paul 05:34, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] fix this article please or i will

this needs a major rewrite, its so bad i think anyone who spends a few hours reading the articles on Content management, content management systems, document management, digital assest managment, etc etc will be able to hack something better together. as it stands today the article is so full of sales speak that its essentially useless. its like some trying to sell coca-cola but never mentioning the name of the product! Catfoo 22:52, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

This article is no advertisement for a product or a service. There is no sales speak in the article. The article describes a segment of information technology with its components. ECM is defined by its components. The definition and the scope of enterprise content management is acknowldged by an industry with several hundred vendors including IBM, Microsoft, Oracle, EMC and others. The defintion and the related components were defined by the association of this industry, AIIM. I think the article is very useful to get a complete overview about this important topic.

@ catfoo: everybody can edit an article on wikipedia. So if you have the feeling you have enough knowledge about the subject you may start to rewrite it. If you want to rewrite the article please make sure that for every erased section or topic you generate an additional article so that no part of the relevant information is lost. And please don`t get angry if others correct you or revert your contributions.

213.39.131.79 12:22, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

Just a passing note, it's not required to preserve all content in an article even when the article was originally a cohesive whole written by a single author (that's what edit histories are for). It is important though to leave an edit summary and/or talk comment regarding why the content was removed. See Constructionism and reductionism (wiki) for the relevant 'philosophical positions'--what I stated is what appears to me to be de facto policy.Antonrojo 13:50, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

The questions are: Is the article too long? Is there redundancy? Is it a question of style? Is it a question of terminology? Is it a question of NPOV?

As author of the original article I tried to give a comprehensive view about all definitions, strategies and components of ECM. I tried to give every component of ECM the same weight in length and content in the different chapters. The article uses the terminology of our industry, which might be the reason for the post of catfoo. But most of the terms are linked to other articles giving more and detailed information. Catfoo complains about sales speak and indirect advertising (although the article names companies only in the last section), bad content (compiling information from other wikipedia articles is not the way to write a new article on a different topic), and that the article is useless (the request to wikify is now on the article for several weeks but there have been no major changes to the content). So let's see what happens to the article ... although the title of the entry "fix this article please or i will" sounds a little like a "thread" to me ... Kff 14:16, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

i assume you meant threat instead of thread, if so yes its kinda of a threat, as you just mentioned the "requet to wikify" has been on for several weeks, im new to wikipedia and i am not in the ECM industry but if this article is just going to sit i guess ill throw my two cents in. im just trying to get some movement on this. i probebly should have just kept my mouth shut. im not a very good writer, please understand that i was not trying to indicate that the article was doing indirect advertising, the issue is a question of style and too many undefined industry terms. for example what is a "accelerating business velocities"? im really not trying to be a troll here, ill read it carefully and see if i can find something specific to work on thats still within my scope of knowledge for this topic Catfoo 23:57, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your comment, catfoo. No "thread" no "threat" just gaming with words. I found the second paragraph with your example "accelerating business velocities" and just kept it - to leave at least a bit of the original authors work. Even as beginner you can start with small changes in style, even if you are not very familiar with the topic. In regard to the industry terms - yes - it is a jungle of acronyms. But this applies to every industry and every science. I believe the explanations in the text provide enough background and there are the links to more detailed articles. Kff 09:01, 5 July 2006 (UTC)

Criticisms of style and POV aside, this is a very respectable paper, Kff. I don't think there are very many like it, for breadth and detail. It's nice to see, for example, that you have not written only about what "ECM" might mean in large companies and agencies (over 1000 employees - where the market is mostly focused, as reflected in much of the jargon and the trends); you have included in the description technologies and strategies that are used by smaller or older organizations; so that for example, so-called "ECM-Lite" will not fall outside of your definition, as it does in some papers that are written by vendors.

For a general encyclopedia, the article has the problem of being too technical. I don't think that it's possible to avoid all technical terminology, in an article about technology; but many ideas should be expressed more simply - in the voice of information for the uninformed, rather than so much like a presentation for professionals. It's in that spirit that I made my edits to the opening paragraphs. — Mark (Mkmcconn) ** 0032, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for your comment and your edits, Mark. Your changes in the opening paragraphs of the article are in a section, I found here before adding my text. Together with the "history" of ECM I believe it is now a very comprehensive article (although there might be a lot of details in regard to the history which are still missing). Kff 16:52, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

If you upload your diagrams to the Commons, they can be accessed on all of the wikipedias, with the same mark-up syntax that's used for locally stored images. — Mark (Mkmcconn) ** 22:33, 8 August 2006 (UTC)

I will provide diagrams with English text next week. Kff 17:51, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Actually I found this article has grown into something a little difficult to read. This is probably due to the hodge podge nature of what ECM is. However I think it may be worth breaking it down into ECM has these parts and they have the parts defined in other articles. Happyfish 06:29, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

There have been a lot of un-consolidated additions to the article of Kff and the illustrations are still missing. By the way, Kff wrote a new publication about ECM which is available on the internet. It is in English, French, and German. It provides some new arguments for ECM and has a more clear structure [1]. 213.39.230.91 17:42, 9 November 2006 (UTC)