Talk:Bastille Day

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removed or for the pedantic "Fête de la Fédération"

never heard of. Anthère

me neither - Tarquin 10:47 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Heard of it. Apparently, the origin of the celebration is the anniversary of the Fête de la Fédération on July 14, 1790, which itself commemorated the fall of the Bastille. David.Monniaux 10:47, 15 Dec 2004 (UTC)

---

removing also this: " and is similar in some respects to the "Fourth of July" in the United States, and September 16 in Mexico" -- irrelevant US POV -- Tarquin 10:47 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)

glad you did it. Thought of doing myself, but did not dare :-) Anthère

Contents 1 Thatcher 2 Fête de la Fédération 3 Storming of the Bastille 4 Vandalism? "Sexual attacks" 5 The "Other references" section

[edit] Thatcher

The Thatcher quote is actually kind of marvelous, but does anyone have a citation for it? -- Jmabel | Talk 01:19, July 16, 2005 (UTC)

• FWIW, a search on "Thatcher" + "Bastille" quickly shows many web sites that indicate that she said this at the time of the 200th anniversary of the Storming of the Bastille, but none of the first few look any more authoritative than us (blogs, etc.). Is someone interested in taking the time to find something solid? -- Jmabel | Talk 20:26, July 16, 2005 (UTC)

It may not be an exact quote but there was definitely a large amount of uproar when Thatcher made some factually accurate but provocative statements at the time of the 200th anniversary celebrations. Someone in the UK ( I am not in the UK ) needs to go to a library and trudge through historical newspaper cuttings from this time. From memory she also said that the UK had the Magna Carta hundreds of years before the French fundamental human rights declaration. Come to think of it, perhaps she's right, why don't the French celebrate the declaration or other meaningful events of their revolution rather than the release of prisoners from the Bastille ? She is also supposed to have placed a portrait of Admiral Lord Nelson on the wall behind Mitterands chair ( which he is said to have noticed due to its prominence ) during a formal lunch at Downing Street.

The French do not celebrate the "release of prisoners from the Bastille" (there were very few of them, about 7, and they were either madmen or actual criminals). What is celebrated is the 1790 Fête de la Fédération, which was a politically significant event. Rama 11:08, 5 August 2005 (UTC)

If Bastille Day is about celebrating the 1790 Fête de la Fédération, then I think this article could be expanded to explain what the Fête was. All we know so far is the original date, and that it has apparent significance. The article Fête de la Fédération redirects to Bastille Day. It's perhaps interesting to note that whilst many people worldwide associate Bastille Day with the Bastille storming, it seems that few know what it is that's being celebrated. I wonder if this view of mine is widespread: I think it certainly is outside of France, but inside France too, does the average person in the populace at large know what their national holiday celebrates, I wonder.

• I have now translated ( Babelfish ) the French wikipedia article on the Fete...it says that it needs expanding admittedly, but it says that most French believe that they celebrate the Bastille storming, not the Fete. Also, it says that the Fete was basically a bit of a big party, and the most significant event of the day was the announcement of the restoration of the French monarchy, albeit as a constitutional monarchy. I think this English wikipedia article needs more serious work done on it, as there must be more to what the French celebrate than this. Does France, that most proud of replublican countries, really celebrate the day on which a party was held to celebrate the storming of the Bastille and the monarchy was restored ? There must be more to it than this....or is there ?

The Monarchy was not restored on the 14 July 1790; at that date, the monarchy had never ceased to exist. This feast was set to mark the improvements made over one year toward a national reconciliation, after the storming of the Bastille itself and the political fights between tenants of a strict "godly-Right monarchy" (monarchie de Droit divin) and those favouring a constitutional monarchy closer to that of England, for instance. At this time, republicans were a tiny minority. Only after the king's treason toward the nation did Republic become a mainstream value in some parts of France and notably Paris (in the South, people would have favoured a federal state rather than a centralised Republic, and in Vendea and in the East were numerous nostalgic of the monarchy). Rama 06:31, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Fête de la Fédération

I have turned Fête de la Fédération into a stand-alone article with a quick-and-dirty draft, I hope that this might help a little bit. Rama 08:30, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

By the way, there was already a stub about this, by the name "Champs-de-Mars Federation". I merged and made it into a redirect. Rama 08:38, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

I like the quick-and-dirty draft you've just knocked up - the most comprehensive quick-and-dirty work I have seen in a long time. It seems that there is universal confusion as to what Bastille Day ( as us English speakers incorrectly label it ) is for, amongst the general French population too, according to the French wikipedia article on the Bastille.

Yes, it is correct that the the 14th of July is usually associated with the storming of the Bastille, even in France. I suppose that in retrospect, the "Fête de la Fédération" sort of washed away, in the light of the treason of the king and the subsequent wars. Perhaps, if war had not broke out and if Louis XVI had really played by the rules, the feelings would be different now.... (alternative History anyone ? :) ). Rama 09:32, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Storming of the Bastille

There seems to be threads of facts ( and perhaps fiction too ) on the following pages concerning the storming of the Bastille:-

• Bastille
• Storming of the Bastille
• French Revolution
• Bastille Day

There's a clear case for trimming down or otherwise consolidating this info. For a start, it's transpired that Bastille Day has only a passing association to the actual storming of the Bastille, so the storming write up on this page probably needs migrating elsewhere. Now, who's French and actually knows the facts...

Yes, I would tend to suggest sizing down the part about the storming of the Bastille here. Actually, I would suggest something like:

1) A general introduction

2) Historical background, divided into:

2.a) Some quick hints about the storming of the Bastille, with a "main article here" line

a.b) the same about the Fête de la Fédération

3) The part about how it is usually celebrated (military parade, etc)

4) History of the event itself (like, for instance, particularly remarkable commemorations, how it was celebrated under the Occupation by the Nazis, etc.)

5 and following) The usual "trivia", "see also" and "external links" things.

I'll be busy this week but I might try and lend a hand if this plan (or another one) is agreed upon. Cheers ! Rama 11:05, 8 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Vandalism? "Sexual attacks"

Is this for real? -- Coneslayer 17:01, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

Probably vandalism. Certainly improbable and uncited. - Jmabel | Talk 06:25, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The "Other references" section

The "Other references" section strikes me as all either off topic (Burke) or trivia that casts no light on the topic (everything else there). Unless someone makes a good case for this section that I'm somehow not grasping, I would like to delete it. - Jmabel | Talk 06:31, 18 July 2006 (UTC)

It's been five days, no answer, I'll delete. - Jmabel | Talk 05:51, 23 July 2006 (UTC)