Talk:HAL 9000
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[edit] HAL = IBM
For anybody who still believes that this was a coincidence, here's what Doug Trumbull had to say about IBM:
quote IBM was the original contractor for much of the computer interface design on the film. There were IBM logos designed for the film, and there were IBM design consultants working with Kubrick on the layout of the controls and computer screens. It was only when they found out that HAL was going to go apeshit and kill the whole crew that IBM pulled out of the project and all the logos came off. unquote
"even getting one of his characters to deny it in the sequel 2010 Odyssey Two"
- That was from the book and not the movie 2010: The Year We Make Contact, right? I only read the book 2010 once, but have seen the movie 7 or 8 times and can't remember that statement form the film. --User:maveric149
- Might well be the case, I haven't seen the film, but Dr Chandra definitely denies it in the book. If so, revise the article. --Robert Merkel
- Yeah, in the book, Dr Chandra says something like "I would have though that by now, any fool would know that HAL stands for Heuristic ALgorythm" (modulo thranslation, I don't have the original version). By the way, anyone knows the real name of Dr Chandra ? I recall his real name is longer, like Chandrasekhar or something... Rama 07:20, 3 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- Dr. Chandrasegrampilli, I believe, modulo spelling. Anville 15:23, 3 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- Yeah, in the book, Dr Chandra says something like "I would have though that by now, any fool would know that HAL stands for Heuristic ALgorythm" (modulo thranslation, I don't have the original version). By the way, anyone knows the real name of Dr Chandra ? I recall his real name is longer, like Chandrasekhar or something... Rama 07:20, 3 Sep 2004 (UTC)
- Might well be the case, I haven't seen the film, but Dr Chandra definitely denies it in the book. If so, revise the article. --Robert Merkel
"A similar alphabetic shift is behind the abbreviation WNT for Windows NT." Would somebody like to explain this? I don't get it - seems to be a fairly straightforward abbreviation, not an alphabetic shift. It certainly doesn't seem to be analogous to IBM->HAL. The equivalent would be XOU or VMS... GRAHAMUK 00:12, 8 Aug 2003 (UTC)
- VMS is exactly right. Consider who developed VMS, and later developed Windows NT. -- Karada 00:21, 8 Aug 2003 (UTC)
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- Okaaay.... that is not at all clear in this article. But I also think it's purely a coincidence, no? GRAHAMUK
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- No cooincidence. I have a friend who used to work with Dave Cutler (who wrote WinNT) when he worked in the VMS security group at Digital. Branciforte3241 06:08, 11 August 2006 (UTC)
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In the sequel the existance of another is revealed? I thought it was in the first one too - didn't it fail to generate the same error? 207.189.98.44 22:29, 8 Jan 2004 (UTC)
- That is correct. Both the book and the film, 2001, make it plain that there were several HAL 9000 models and that Mission Control had another one back on Earth which did not make the prediction about the Discovery's communications link failing in 24 hours. -- Derek Ross
[edit] It's from Urbana!
Was NCSA active in any form when the book was written? The article on NCSA gives a founding year of 1986, but I wonder if something of note computer-wise must have been going on at UIUC much earlier. -- knoodelhed 07:18, 12 Mar 2004 (UTC)
-- The introduction is some what fractured, "He... He... He...", I will fix it, and you can discuss if my changes were an improvement. --ShaunMacPherson 16:50, 11 Apr 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Triple redundancy?
Removed from the article:
- In the 2001 movie HAL features a design with triple redundancy, so that if one of the three modules fails the other two can outvote it. However, the formal study of fault-tolerant computing shows that such a vote-based sanity check will not actually protect against the failure of a single node in a three-node system like HAL. Thus the failure of only a single one of HAL's redundant modules would be sufficient to compromise the system, as apparently happened in the movie. It is not known whether Kubrick and Clarke were aware of this fact when they wrote the story.
Where in the movie does it say this? Where are the lines of dialogue? Cite, please. -- The Anome 19:16, 4 Jun 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Wordplay
First of all, kudos for re-organizing the "wordplay" section.
- In 2010: Odyssey Two, the character Dr. Chandra, HAL's creator, states that the name means "Heuristically programmed ALgorithmic computer". When Clarke devised this version of the name is unclear.
I may be completely mistaken, but I believe this acronym appears in the 2001 novel, soon after HAL is introduced. —Anville 16:17, 5 Sep 2004 (UTC)
The wordplay part was removed: [1]. I came to this page from 2001: A Space Odyssey, only to find the link HAL 9000#HAL wordplay is now nonexistent. --Menchi 02:38, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)
- I've corrected this link from 2001: A Space Odyssey and 2001: A Space Odyssey (novel). --Bruce1ee 11:09, 26 August 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Fictional character?
In the intro HAL is refered to as a fictional character – should this not be fictional computer? --Bruce1ee 11:09, 26 August 2005 (UTC)
- I've changed the intro to read "fictional computer/character" (HAL was actually a bit of both). I've also added the year 2001 first appeared (which is important to show the context in which it appeared) and a new section "The future of computing". --Bruce1ee 13:16, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
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- Well yes, since HAL is fully conscious, he qualifies also as a character :p I wonder whether he votes. Rama 13:22, 31 August 2005 (UTC)
[edit] lol? in a article?
somebody should clean up that section.
--80.121.21.236 08:16, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
- indeed. I have moved this to the talkpage, see what we can do with it... Rama 08:26, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
__________ While some of you may be aware that the HAL 9000 was a Heuristically programmed ALgorithmic computer, while the female version developed years later and used to test a complete shut down/start up simulation in the initial proceedure to insure that HAL could be brought back online by Dr. Chandra was a SAL 9000, Stochastically programmed ALgorithmic computer. This is interesting as her architecture would not actually correctly emulate the HAL 9000, except as a macroroutine, and in which case, it was not necessary to shut her down to run the emulation of HAL. ---Heuristic- involving or serving as an aid to learning, discovery, or problem- solving by experimental and especially trial-and-error methods <heuristic techniques> <a heuristic assumption>; also : of or relating to exploratory problem-solving techniques that utilize self-educating techniques (as the evaluation of feedback) to improve performance <a heuristic computer program> ---Stochistic- RANDOM; specifically : involving a random variable <a stochastic process> 2 : involving chance or probability : PROBABILISTIC <a stochastic model of radiation-induced mutation> Thus in Arthur Clarke's mind, the male was locked into a loop of error, based on his faith in his creator and so was terminated, and it took the female to provide a RIB (Release InhiBition) and so allow Dr. Chandra to bring HAL back to life.... lol It is also interesting to note that the Holographic Isoplanar blocks of memory used as the core on the HAL contained a trillion trillion bytes of capacity, even by 1968 spectrographic film resolution technology... which of course, was not necessary. The use of pre-encoded Holography for the core, pretty well neutralizes the Heuristic potential of the computer. In today's world (2005), all those memory blocks would compress down to less than the size of a DVD, be 1/2 inch thick, be made of lithium nobate or other Chinese Crystal and maintain write/RW capacity of over 50 trillion bytes! In other words, HAL could be implimented in a standard desksize computer case. SAL, who will be a Quantum Computer, will be even smaller. --J.D.
- I've moved more discussion text by 71.37.1.193 from the article to here. --Bruce1ee 09:58, 24 September 2005 (UTC)
__________ While some of you may be aware that the HAL 9000 was a Heuristically programmed ALgorithmic computer, while the female version developed years later and used to test a complete shut down/start up simulation in the initial proceedure to insure that HAL could be brought back online by Dr. Chandra was a SAL 9000, Stochastically programmed ALgorithmic computer. This is interesting as her architecture would not actually correctly emulate the HAL 9000, except as a macroroutine, and in which case, it was not necessary to shut her down to run the emulation of HAL. ---Heuristic- involving or serving as an aid to learning, discovery, or problem- solving by experimental and especially trial-and-error methods <heuristic techniques> <a heuristic assumption>; also : of or relating to exploratory problem-solving techniques that utilize self-educating techniques (as the evaluation of feedback) to improve performance <a heuristic computer program> ---Stochistic- RANDOM; specifically : involving a random variable <a stochastic process> 2 : involving chance or probability : PROBABILISTIC <a stochastic model of radiation-induced mutation> Thus in Arthur Clarke's mind, the male was locked into a loop of error, based on his faith in his creator and so was terminated, and it took the female to provide a RIB (Release InhiBition) and so allow Dr. Chandra to bring HAL back to life.... lol ---Dr. Jon. Dark __________ __________ It is also interesting to note that the Holographic Isoplanar blocks of memory used as the core on the HAL contained a trillion trillion bytes of capacity, even by 1968 spectrographic film resolution technology... which of course, was not necessary. The use of pre-encoded Holography for the core, pretty well neutralizes the Heuristic potential of the computer. In today's world (2005), all those memory blocks would compress down to less than the size of a DVD, be 1/2 inch thick, be made of lithium nobate or other Chinese Crystal and maintain write/RW capacity of over 50 trillion bytes! Here is a Holographic processing cell of 3 meg. tesselations x 9 matix layers deep.[2] In other words, HAL could be implimented in a standard desksize computer case. SAL, who will be a Quantum Computer, will be even smaller.- Dr. Jon Dark
[edit] Quote
I really think the famous and memorable quote "I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that." ought to be mentioned in the article... I'm just not sure exactly where it would fit best.
It's in the 2001: A Space Odyssey G Clark 21:25, 6 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Size and ubiquitousity of computers
I am a but unhappy with this part:
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- The film's creators felt that as computers got more powerful, they would get bigger and bigger. HAL occupies much of the living area on Discovery and nowhere are there any desktop computers, laptops, PDAs or even digital watches.
- HAL is not larger than the first computers; "as computers got more powerful, they would get bigger and bigger" leaves the impression that HAL is bigger than anything that ever lived, but I think that it would not be huge compared to, say, ENIAC.
- There are actually computers basically everywhere, when you look at the interiors of the moon shuttle, typically. On Discovery, there are terminals to HAL everywhere as well.
An now for something completely different: Anyone compared the image below with the HAL9000 logo featured on the cameras ? :) Rama 09:42, 13 December 2005 (UTC)
[edit] A Few Things
- I think in the trivia section, there isn't much real trivia there. Most of it is parodies of HAL. Care Bears? Dexter's Lab? They aren't really notable in my mind. Maybe we should keep only a few nice parodies.
- How about moving HAL's French name to trivia?
- In the opening, it says "In the 2001 film, HAL is depicted...". I think it's worded poorly; it makes it seem as if the movie came out in 2001. How about just "In the film, HAL is depicted..."?
[edit] Cited References
The little blurb about the pod being in Star Wars Episode I can't possibly be true can it? I thought it was a well known fact that Kubrick had all props and sets from 2001 destroyed. Also I've looked at the scene mentioned and I see no such pod, so I'm going to delete this for the time being. Penarestel 04:42, 7 May 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Computer chess history
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HAL9000#The_future_of_computing
This section implies that a full chess program was a fantasy in 1968 but that is completely false. The first full chess playing programs came out in the fifties.
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess_%28programming%29#Chronology_of_computer_chess
I don't feel like editing it but I thought I'd point it out...
[edit] Pictures in Article
How is it that among the pitures in the article, there isn't one of a close-up on HAL's eye? Seems like that's what people visualize when thinking of HAL 9000.
I agree. I'd put it in, but it's getting late, and I'm tired. Maybe in a few days...--Planetary 05:27, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
I can't find a good image. I don't own the actual film, so I can't take a screenshot, and the others I found aren't exactly as in the movie. If somone else has it perhaps they could?--Planetary 04:43, 25 September 2006 (UTC)
- A bit of a late message, but I put it in before.--Planetary 03:51, 30 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] HAL 90,000
I accidently reverted Andy12090's edit because I thought I'd made a typo. Does anyone have a copy of Odyssey Two handy? Was it the HAL 10,000 or the HAL 90,000? (DrZarkov 22:54, 7 September 2006 (UTC))
- I have read the book. It is HAL 10,000. Andy120290 00:09, 8 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] questionable prediction
When the film 2001 was first screened in 1968, the year 2001 was a long way away and a computer like HAL seemed quite plausible at the time. In the mid-1960s computer scientists were generally optimistic that within a generation or two we would have machines that could pass the Turing test.
I'm not sure that this is true. Till the early 80s, computer scientists believed that the problems with single layer neural nets would extend to multi-layer neural nets. In the early 80s (IIRC) it was discovered that multi-layer neural nets could work around the limitations inherant in single layer neural nets, serving as a crucial breakthrough in the field of pattern recognition. Someone who understands the field better may want to rewrite that section, or else provide a source for the stated optimism.
[edit] Correction to Popular Culture Section
The last portion of text claims that the HAL 9000 blew up because of Insanity Prawn Boy, it was in fact because of Dave from Eurythmics who had messed around with HAL's memory, causing it to malfunction and blow up.
Also, do we really need to know about a Weebl cartoon when talking about HAL?
[edit] Scale of HAL 9000
In a footnote on page 2-4 of the text "Physics for Future Presidents," the author argues that the size of HAL is a "fundamental oversight" since light travels about 1 foot per nanosecond, and computers do calculations in cycles of on the order of billionths of seconds (given present technology; presumably an artificially intelligent system would be even faster). This entails that computers must be small, and the author argues that making HAL's "core" large enough for a human to walk into is nonsensical. http://muller.lbl.gov/teaching/Physics10/PffP.html --babbage 05:15, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
- Well, that's why its called fiction. Next thing you know, someone will say the Monolith wasn't really full of stars!--Planetary 05:31, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
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- Hehe, true enough -- artistic license and all that. I'm just wondering if it's worth a mention in the article. --babbage 20:49, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
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- I doubt it. The main 2001 article mentions what the movie got right about the future, and what it got wrong.--Planetary 02:02, 21 February 2007 (UTC)
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[edit] Fairchild-Curtis
The article states: "This Fairchild-Curtis wide angle lens was not used as the eye in the Hal 9000 prop seen in film, because this Fairchild-Curtis wide angle lens is about 8" in diameter, while the Hal 9000 prop eye is about 3" in diameter." I'm not sure if this is correct - few years ago someone was selling one of the actual 2001 HAL's eye props on eBay. It consisted of the familiar panel and logo as seen in the film and a Fairchild-Curtis lens as the eye. It sold for I forget how many digits. I wish I saved that page. (I did save the page offering one of the helmets from 2001 for sale though!) JanPB 05:14, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
Ah, just found in some old notes: it sold for $120,000 on eBay. JanPB 05:18, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
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