Talk:Hecate
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[edit] Festivals
A "citation needed" link appears at the end of this passage, however, the information is clearly cited as Ruickbie (2004). I have therefore removed this request.
[edit] Trivia
Who on earth confused Hecate with Trivia? I really, really want the reference work that makes that mistake. Trivia is Artemis/Diana, if she's not an independent deity. Why do I get the feeling that this article was written by a Wiccan and not a Classicist? Geogre 02:46, 27 Sep 2004 (UTC)
Wikipedia is the reference work that makes that mistake now. Thanks for using your expertise to clear up the confusion. You could have just ranted about it on the talk page without changing anything.
I myself must defer to the authority of 1911 Britannica, at least until an expert comes and corrects matters. Vivacissamamente 23:13, 8 Oct 2004 (UTC)
- I'm generally a proponent of 'Pagan' Religions, but honestly this article should be renamed 'Hecate (Wicca)' since it has very little to say about Hecate the Greek mythological figure. Robrecht 2 July 2005 16:57 (UTC)
- So edit. Add referenced material. I plan to. Wiccan material should be moved to the end, in its own section. --Nantonos 22:24, 26 July 2005 (UTC)
1911 Britannica is out of date in terms of information on Hecate. Sarah Iles Johnston is considered one of the foremost modern historians of Hecate and in her two books (referenced in further readings) she traces Hecate's origins from Turkey into Greece and her development as a sorceress goddess. I changed some of the main entry to accommodate her research which she properly references in her two books. Also, I didn't erase anythign already on the page as it seemed accurate, just moved some stuff arouond.
Also what is with these references to the snake and Hecate holding one. I know of no references to snakes being scared to Hecate, and those images are probaly of Hecate holding a rope. (unsigned, but comments above added by User:Dorcia)
- Please sign your comments with four tildes (~) in a row to add your name and date automaticaly. DreamGuy 21:31, August 28, 2005 (UTC)
I have clarified that Hecate is not Trivia, among assorted other tidying-up. However, I have also come across statements such as The Romans gave Hekate the title Trivia, the Latin equivalent of the Greek Trioditis. on the otherwise careful and well-referenced theoi.com for example. --Nantonos 15:36, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Shakespeare
Shakespeare mentions Hecate in Macbeth (text is here). Hecate is in Act III, Scene V and Act IV, Scene I. However, considering that Hecate's lines in these scenes do not fit in tone with the rest of the play, some people think that Shakespeare didn't actually write them, but they were inserted in later. Can someone research up on this and add it to the article? Bbhtryoink 01:39, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
- And lo, it is done! The Singing Badger 01:43, 27 May 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Cruft
A load of half-digested material has been dumped into this formerly careful account. I have tagged some statements for citations but it looks hopeless. --Wetman 22:35, 18 July 2005 (UTC)
- I found citations for some (if they happened to be correct), added quotes against others (where they are commonly cited but likely incorrect) and added some more [citation needed] tagging to the rest.--Nantonos 15:36, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Format
Can someone pull the layout together, please? I'm bored with encountering doctrinaire troglodytes over layouts, myself, but this is just not good enough at present. I'd add a "clean-up" sticker, if I were the sticker type.--Wetman 07:03, 25 August 2005 (UTC)
- I have done some cleanup, collecting together the references for example. There still needs to be some merging of attributes into the representations section. --Nantonos 15:36, 16 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] NeoPagan NPOV
I have pulled the contentious "Most sects that include worship of Hecate are considered cults, even by Neopagan standards. Such sects often encourage experimentation with the paranormal." and changed 'sect' to 'group' in the remaining part of that paragraph, because of NPOV. I also pulled the inflamatory "In some cases animal sacrifices have been documented, typically taking place on the last day of a month. Animal sacrifices have included the sacrifice of goats, dogs, and chickens, which has been documented by police authorities and is often mistaken with satanic practices. Animal sacrifices is considered in the United States to be animal cruelty and is subsequently illegal, regardless of religious faith." and invite whoever posted that to put it back if they have a citeable source. --Nantonos 14:03, 27 August 2005 (UTC)
I pulled out the reference to the Celtic festival of Samhain. There is no scholarly basis for that statement, and until it can be proved that there is an actual connection, I hope that will not be put up again. Also, the entire section about emblems seems to be mostly unsubstantiated. I hesitate to remove it completely, but I wouldn't mind if someone did so. Again, until it can be proved that there is an actual, documented connection between many (not all) of those emblems, then I would recommend deleting that section until further information has been discovered, complete with corroboration. Ryan 10:11, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
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- Well done. --Wetman 13:01, 28 December 2005 (UTC)
[edit] "Wilderness"
"... originally a goddess of the wilderness" It's not "wilderness" if you live there. What is the thought buried in this expression, still in the opening of the article? --Wetman 16:48, 15 October 2005 (UTC)
- I'm guessing exactly what wilderness implies. people live in a village, there's forest around it. She was a goddess of area lying outside of towns, places not domesticated. it can still be wilderness if you live there. i don't see a problem with it at all. (Anonymous)
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- The forest around even the smallest Greek settlement, though beyond the reach of agriculture, was not "wilderness". There were many deities in those utterly familiar woodlands, to be sure: of trees and groves, of water sources and rivers, of mountaintops, caves and clefts. Would Potnia theron, "mistress of the animals", or "Mountain Mother" be goddesses of the "wilderness"? Or Artemis? Perhaps so. --Wetman 18:30, 29 October 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Modern character interpretations
"Hecate provided friendship to the goddess Persephone who was newly arrived in the Underworld. Thankful for her friendship with his grieving wife, Hades honored Hecate by making her a permanent guest in the spirit world, allowing her to come and go as she wished." I moved this here: is there any psychological interpretation in surviving myth or ritual to suggest this, or is it from Xena Warrior Princess? A myth justifying Hades displacement of Hecate would be useful. --Wetman 20:47, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] "Hecate: Ancient, Powerful, Unconquerable" section
I've toned down the assertive rant to make this encyclopedic, and I've deleted the contentious supposed parallels with Virgin Mary. Material like this needs to be brought in as a report of what has been published on the subject. The survival of aspects of Hecate cult in peasant religion and Wicca does need to be reintroduced.--Wetman 19:14, 13 December 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Yew berries and hallucinations
The article currently states that yew berries (the non-poisonous arils) can cause hallucinations if prepared correctly. The source cited may be "The Encyclopedia of Psychoactive Plants: Ethnopharmacology and Its Applications" by Christian Rätsch [1], or other books and articles by the same author (in German or English), or any of a number of books ("Plants of the Gods" [2], "Witchcraft Medicine" [3]) written in collaboration with other authors. Unfortunately, none of these books/artices/etc are searchable on Amazon.
Rätsch is an ethnopharmacologist. According to this interview, his doctorate is in "Native American cultures", not any kind of medicine or pharmacology. I point this out not as an insult to the man, but only because I have been unable to find any reliable source for the claim that yew berries can be used as hallucinogens. According to the medical information I've been able to find, even the toxic parts of the yew plants do not cause hallucinations. I have found no indication that there are any ill or unusual effects of ingesting just the arils (no seeds/leaves/etc). Even Erowid has nothing on it. Without access to the source, I have no idea what is meant by "prepared correctly", but I can't find evidence that any preparation of yew would cause hallucinations short of one that involved lacing the berries with LSD. Are there any objections to removing this claim from the article? - AdelaMae (t - c - wpn) 02:48, 11 February 2007 (UTC)
