Talk:John Lydon
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I didnt know The Sex Pistols were still together, that would make sense because I changed Is to was the lead singer of the sex pistols but someone reversed the edit.
I've reversed the redirect that previously took us from John Lydon to Johnny Rotten, as Lydon used the name 'Rotten' only whilst a member of the Sex Pistols, which was for about 4 years. He declared the persona of 'Johnny Rotten' dead when he left the Pistols, and went on to form PiL, and from then on used the name Lydon. He's had a 24 year career since then as Lydon, so to me it seems more appropriate that Rotten should redirect to lydon rather than vice versa. quercus robur 09:42, 11 Oct 2003 (UTC)
- I disagree... regardless of the length of time he was in the Sex Pistols, most people would still remember him for that, and the policy is that whatever the 'most commonly used name by the public' is for a person, that should be its title. However, with redirects I don't think it matters much. --plattopus (talk) 16:10, Mar 23, 2005 (UTC)
--- Whats the policy on including profanity? I forget. GWO 16:00, 4 Feb 2004 (UTC)
- Include where necessary, redact when prurient. What you have is fine, I think. If someone were to add the "fuck" incident (which was on Parkinson, I think) then I think that should be spelled out, unstared (as it's something of a famous moment, because of the word). Opinions vary. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 16:17, 4 Feb 2004 (UTC)
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- Is this consistent with current situation of spelling-out the f-word butstarring-out the c-word? Pete/Pcb21 (talk) 19:27, 4 Feb 2004 (UTC)
There's far too much stuff I think on I'm A Celebrity I think. Maybe we could have more on the journalism and (serious) TV work instead? Andrew
May also want to mention something about the Rotten TV series on VH1 ("I want my rotten TV!"). Was extremely short-lived, but still... 11:11, Mar 13 2006
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[edit] Photos
I think there's a bit too many photographs on this page... — mæstro t/c, 07:33, 15 January 2006 (UTC)
- You could also argue that there's extremely little on PiL, and because it's one sentence it's contained in the Sex Pistols section, even though PiL lasted about five longer than the Pistols. I guess it doesn't matter since not a lot of interesting stuff happened with the band other than the albums they put out, whilst the short amount of time with the Pistols was much more eventful. I'll let you decide. Sly
- Glad we have the obscure Danish variation on his world-famous assumed name right in the first sentence where the crowds will be expecting it. Brodo 06:46, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Anarchist?!
Is there any info on Lydon's politics? I seriously doubt he is an anarchist. The Ungovernable Force 03:47, 19 March 2006 (UTC)
- After a web search, he claims to be an anarchist in an interview with the Guardian[1].
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- He returns to a favourite subject - class. How would he define himself politically? "Asexual...I don't know...individual." He says he has learnt over the years how to make life better for himself, and he'd love to help do the same for society as a whole. It's a big ambition, I say, how would you set about it?
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- "You've got to stop interfering with individual space," he says. "You've got to stop telling people what is good or bad for them. If you wanna be a raging drug addict, go forth young man, I'm not stopping you, but I'm not paying for it. Right! Get the poncing off the system attitude removed, and then realise what freedom is. Freedom isn't to do what you want at somebody else's expense."
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- It sounds like a form of anarchy? "It is, but it's a proper kind. It's not just knock it all down with no set of rules. Rules are important, but they're temporary and they're always supposed to be changed."
So yes, he is an anarchist. Probably an individualist anarchist. There we go. And he has, in plenty of other interviews, not confirmed that he is an anarchist, but not contradicted anyone who called him such. --Switch 08:26, 30 March 2006 (UTC)
- But is he an antichrist? MrBlondNYC 13:23, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
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- "a proper kind (of anarchy)"... hahah. he is NOT saying HE IS AN ANARCHIST with that. He even refers to anarchy as if they were a good one (the proper one) and the bad one (probably the kind he spoke in their lyrics with the Sex Pistols). I would prefer to remove this guy from the Anarchist category. I don't think he has anything to do with anarchism. please, provide sources that shows he is (or consider himself) an anarchist, because those quotes don't mean a thing. thanks, -Cacuija (my talk) 03:11, 13 October 2006 (UTC)
- Also note the top note at the top of this page:
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- I will be removing him from the Category:Anarchists if nobody shows evidence that he is an anarchist. that phrase doesn't mean he's an anarchist or self-proclaism as such. thanks, -Cacuija (my talk) 18:51, 23 October 2006 (UTC)
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- "It sounds like a form of anarchy?"
- "It is..."
- How can you claim he does not consider himself an anarchist? I would agree there are "bad types" and "good types" of anarchism. You appear not to know a lot about anarchist theory. I already provided sources and you removed him. Time to revert. --Switch 08:00, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
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- UNTIL you DO provide evidence that says he considered himself an anarchist and put it in the article, you cannot place him in the anarchist category. that piece of interview doesn't mean anything. and please keep your comments on whether i know A LOT or not about anarchist concepts, while you mention anarcho-capitalism as a form of anarchism. please. limit to the john lydon talk and provide useful evidence that he is an anarchist. i'm removing him from that list again. --Cacuija (my talk) 20:07, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
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- first off, watch your language and your rage. secondly. Having one `anarchist` idea doesn't make you an anarchist. by this i mean, you cannot consider somebody an anarchist just for having one anarchist (of the 'proper' kind) idea. If you the reporter would have asked him, "do you consider yourself an anarchist" and he replied yes.. I would not be discussing this because wikipedia doesn't have yet a category called Category:Self proclaimed anarchists for people who have nothing to do with anarchism and said one time they were. Again: having said that doesn't put him in the Category:Anarchists. --Cacuija (my talk) 22:11, 27 November 2006 (UTC)
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- On Wikipedia, people who self-identify as anarchists are included in the category for anarchists. Example, Jello Biafra, who ran for office and advocates voting, and Murray Rothbard, an anarcho-capitalist who most anarchists do not consider an anarchist. Calling yourslef an anarchist makes you an anarchist on Wikipedia. He said his political philosophy is a form of anarchism. That makes him a self-proclaimed anarchist. That means he belongs in Category:Anarchists. You of all people do not have the authority to decide who is ad is not an anarchist. By the way, my language and rage are fine. I completely stand by what I said. -Switch t 00:59, 29 November 2006 (UTC)
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- "If you the reporter would have asked him, "do you consider yourself an anarchist" and he replied yes.. I would not be discussing this because wikipedia doesn't have yet a category called Category:Self proclaimed anarchists for people who have nothing to do with anarchism and said one time they were." ...if you know how to read btw lines, you may notice i already knew that people who said 30 years ago they were anarchists they are anarchists for wikipedia. my point is: Is that line, that single "kind of anarchist idea" enough to consider this person an anarchist (i don't care what you/i/the-rest-of-the-world think about lydon, the question is... is serious to consider him and anarchist just for saying that line. again: I HE SAID ONE TIME ,, YES, I AM AN ANARCHIST (no, when i sang "anarchy in the UK" doesn't count) i'm ok and let's put him in this category, it is just that just that line cannot be taken and consider him an anarchist, IMHO. --Cacuija (my talk) 07:28, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
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[edit] Arsenal fan
Could someone include on his page that he is an Arsenal fan? arsenalwwerulz 15:18, 12 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Attack on Green Day
Shouldn't we mention that he attacked green day, and criticised them for not being punk. 82.35.196.55 16:25, 30 July 2006 (UTC) I agree he did attack Green day. DavidJJJ 16:26, 30 July 2006 (UTC)
- Probably not. He attacks a lot of things. WesleyDodds 11:26, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Birth certificate
"birth certificate has been lost" - can't he just get a replacement? is there a source for this? Morwen - Talk 11:31, 3 August 2006 (UTC)
it's possible that he could just get a replacement, but since it's unclear where he was definitely born, he might just find it easier to just not even bother. it says in his book "Rotten: No Irish, No Blacks, No Dogs" that his birth certificate was lost. who lost it is unclear and never mentioned... his parents? him? who knows... Skin Crawl 01:33, 24 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Trivia - John Lydon and Tom Barry
I've tried a couple of times to add a 'trivia' comment on the main page that John Lydon is a grandson of Tom Barry. Any time I have the post has been deleted by the admins. Simple question - why?
From what I can make out, there are three possible reason for deleting this:
1) It’s considered irrelevant as Tom Barry isn’t anybody famous
Granted, many of you from outside Ireland may not have heard of Tom Barry, but I can assure he would be regarded as a significant figure in the history of Twentieth Century Ireland. His account of the Irish War of Independence, 'Guerilla Days in Ireland', is still in print over fifty years after its publication.
2) Libel concerns over linking John Lydon to an “IRA terrorist”
Of course, any mention of an IRA link to Lydon might have raised libel concerns on the part of the editors. If so, this is due purely to ignorance on their part. The Irish Republican Army (IRA) of the 1919-21 war was just that - the army of the yet-to-be-recognised Irish Republic. Most of it became the Irish Army, a minority (including Barry) opposed the treaty with Britain and retained the IRA label. Barry himself resigned from the IRA in 1938. Therefore to say that somebody was involved with the IRA in the War of Independence is to identify them as part of a national army of a fledging state, not a terrorist.
3) You don’t believe they are really related
The only other reason I can think of for deleting this titbit is that you don’t believe it’s true. However my source is impeccable – John Lydon himself. In the early chapters of ‘No Irish, No Blacks, No Dogs’ he talks about his mother, Eileen Barry from Cork. Although he doesn’t actually identify Tom Barry by name, he describes Eileen's father as a leader of the Irish independence army who was famous and 'hated the British'. The only other Barry who could remotely be described as famous from that period was Kevin Barry from Dublin (no relation to Tom), who was hanged at the age of 18 long before he time to think of fathering any children.
It’s evident that Lydon has no idea just how famous his grandfather was and continues to be in Ireland. He would probably scoff at any suggestion that his impulse to rebel and lack of respect for authority to rebel was genetic, but I reckon he could learn a lot about himself by reading his grandfather's life story.
- "Famous" is a fluid term. He could have been referring to anyone. "Barry" could have been an assumed name for his mother; his grandfather may not have been called Barry. He may have avoided naming his grandfather just because he wants not to be connected to him. If a genealogist made the link, or if a positive identification were available, it would belong in, and I think it should be included, but at this point it is speculation. Not until it is stated explicitly by a reliable source can it be included. It's unfortunate, but it isn't allowed in. --Switch t 06:51, 22 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Ari Up?
isn't he to young to be her kids' "grandpa"?
His wife, Nora, is considerably older than him and Ari was about 13/14 when he and Nora started dating. Go figure, eh? He also explains all this in his book. 4.178.132.173 18:35, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
Well Ari had her kid when she was like 19
- He's quite young for being Ari's dad and grandpa for her kids. But so what? Wanna change it? How? What about it? termi 14:51, 10 March 2007 (CEST)
[edit] Homosexual?
could someone start an inquiry into the statement at the beginning of this article that john Lydon is Homosexual? I have never heard such a claim made before. ~~Ben~~ i highly doubt that.
During the case of Lydon versus Malcolm McLaren, several of McLaren's people accused John of harboring "homosexual feelings" toward McLaren, but it was irrelevant to the courtcase and quite frankly, very silly. The fact remains that John Lydon is married and has been for quite a few years. 4.178.132.173 18:35, 11 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] WIkiquote
You have got to love the things this man says! He deserves a wikiquote page and I'll make one probably this weekend, it's easy to find intreviews of him on youtube, he always has something interesting to say! And he has been saying it for a long time now so if anyone opens it beofre me, please sort the quotes by year, for as he says Like fine wine I have improved over the years basically he has admitted he changed, so let's sort em. --Mudel 22:31, 31 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Contact
Anybody any idea how to contact him? It's pretty urgent actually. An agent or something would be alright. termi 14:49, 10 March 2007 (CEST)
[edit] Guitar
His info box indicates that he plays the guitar. In all the years, I've never seen him (live or on concert photos) play this instrument. I haven't got his solo work, so I'm not sure whether he plays guitar (or dabbles with it) on that. Can someone illuminate? Otherwise I'd suggest to remove "guitar" from the infobox.Malljaja 21:03, 28 March 2007 (UTC)
