Talk:Mamoru Chiba

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Archives: 01

Contents 1 Mask/Kamen again 2 Citation of stats issues 3 What? 4 Differences between manga and anime 5 Stats from article 6 vandalism 7 unblock 8 Images

[edit] Mask/Kamen again

This conversation died out. Let's please keep it going until it's solved.

Four voted in favor of using Mask, two voted in favor of Kamen. Points that were raised against using Mask:

• Lack of consistency in article names
• Obvious grossness of calling Chibi Moon "Mini Moon"

Both of these points have been responded to. Tuxedo Whatever won't be the article's name at all, translating Japanese words for the English WP is recommended whenever possible, and the definition of Kamen is never disputed. Other words that we retain in Japanese, such as Senshi and Chibi, have a multitude of possible meanings.

Because these alternate arguments were raised but not responded to, the state of the discussion is unclear. Were they sufficient? Do people still disagree? If so, please explain your thoughts.

Furthermore, if we find ourselves in deadlock, what should we do about it? This isn't the ordinary situation where "no consensus" can just mean "leave it the way it is." Right now the articles use both, and it has the potential to be very confusing. A decision should be reached. I still lean toward Mask, but again, I can be easily dissuaded. --Masamage 23:44, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

My experience of usage on the internet, which is admittedly a couple of years old, is that the people who call him 'Tuxedo Kamen' have tended to be the knowledgable fans of the show, whereas the people who call him 'Tuxedo Mask' have tended to be either its detractors or those who were only familiar with the dub. This leaves me with a pretty strong aesthetic preference for 'Kamen', but I don't know to what degree, if at all, that ought to influence wikipedia. --Glump 00:20, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

I disagree with that. I've been in the fandom since about 1998-1999. It goes both ways. Lunar Archivist who was in the fandom since about 1997? maybe earlier calls him Tuxedo Mask, and he has an insane amount of information on the lore. It's just that the new wave of fans are not as well versed in the series as they used to be. It *used* to be that if you said Do you know the page where Hotaru shows her cybernetic arm people would know the approximate volume number and then tell you it doesn't happen in the anime. Now fans are like, "What? Cybernetic? When?" So it's not out of ignorance that I voted for Mask, it's out of knowing Japanese, knowing the series well and knowing that this page has to be written for not just fans, but other people too. Since it's not his civilian name, but a title (like Sailor Moon is a title, since it will be passed later to Small Lady), I don't see the point in keeping it Japanese when there are no disputes as to what it means. Like we don't call the Prince of Japan Nihon no Ouji. To give you an idea of how deep my fandom is.. I did a High School Senior thesis on the censorship to manga and anime, which focused in on SM... I was nuts back then. Atashi mo nihongo shitteru. There's been fans deeper than I have been that call him Tuxedo Mask. Anyway, I voted in favor of Mask because of the wikipedia rules. This page must be accessible to a number of people outside of the fandom. One would have a stronger case on Wikimoon than here. --Hitsuji Kinno 04:19, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Just for the record, I know Glump to have been into the fandom since at least '96, so when he says "a couple of years old" he is being humble. :) Intensity of investment in the series is extremely beside-the-point, though. --Masamage 05:05, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Well, my purpose in mentioning the 'couple of years' at all was just to make it clear that, these days, I'm kind of out of touch. It sounds like Hitsuji and I are talking about roughly the same period, though, so I don't know what's to blame for our differing experiences; probably some combination of chance, different circles, and treacherous memory.

The argument from the Prince's title makes sense if 'Tuxedo Kamen' is intended to be entirely descriptive in the same way -- if the people who call him that are just approximating 'the man in the tuxedo and mask' -- but I've always taken it to be something more in the way of a proper name. --Glump 10:29, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Umm.. I've taken it as a title, since Sailor Moon, Sailor Mercury, etc are titles, and that's his alter ego, he can pass that title along. ^^;; If you are super comic geek the next sentence will make sense (I hang out with one). Other precedents of titles being passed on where you thought that it just was a proper name: Green Lantern (I heard there were a lot of them) Batman (2 Batmans, and several Robins... not to mention one became Nighthawk?), I think Captain America too... but I'm not sure. But the point is that the title of the comic stayed the same, but the person wearing the mask and doing the good deeds changed. There was Superman, Aquaman, and of course the cast of X-men characters, but the reason behind that was that there was no one invented with similar powers. i.e. no one to take over (or the character is said to live forever (Superman). Thus most super hero names are actually formal titles, like Prince, etc, which are passed person to person, and sometimes even inherited or given. (Royal Titles are sometimes given if the king hates all of his sons... at least I've heard, or the son skips out. For example, Victoria was given the right to be queen... the king and queen at the time didn't have a son, but they could have chosen a male heir too..) If we delve into Japanese anime--there are precedents of this kind of thing too... but it's more in seitei and seitei anime (I think Kamen rider passed his title... not sure, but I heard while I was editing the American version of it that there were several in the series...)... considering that Sailor Moon was based on such anime, it's not that much of a stretch, and considering Sailor Moon is also considered a title, i.e. This title will be passed to Sailor Chibimoon and her daughter, and then her daughter's daughter, it's not that much of a stretch to say that Tuxedo Mask can also be considered a formal title to be passed on. Takeuchi-sensei once joked that Tuxedo Mask had to buy all his roses (it was an audio tape thing... I read the translations, but never could get my hands on them. *sighs*) and he was seen taking off his costume manga side, he transformed anime side (apparently there was an adlib that was cut... Tuxedo, Make up! (Takeuchi's liner notes)) so it's possible for him to simply hand over the title. (Though clearly it can't be inherited). So I wouldn't take it as a formal name attached to him and only him with a birth certificate attached. ^^;; Too much anime, comic book lore, etc shows that he could give it up one day and pass it to someone else. Even SM supports it... making Tuxedo Mask a title. Jackie Chiang as far as I know, uses Tuxedo Mask... didn't Greenbeans, Tim Nolan, etc also use it before they got published and jumped ship? (Tim Nolan co-published with a legend on the writer website community... lucky bastard.) *sighs* I don't meet many fans from back then anymore who know their stuff. Kinda sad... BTW, Doesn't Hitoshi Doi use Tuxedo Mask, I think Ken Aromdee does too, forget SOS and someone take away their privileges permanently (I thought they were gone, but they are worse than the energizer bunny... their site disappeared for a month). Pop Tarts! ha! I was on sailormoon.org most of the time... back then... ^^;; --Hitsuji Kinno 08:47, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

iv also vote mask iv seen jappnese with subs saying mask Sailor cuteness 20:32, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

I vote for Mask. It's not an official title or anything, it's just a name he gives himself, so I think it should be translated to English. Torca 07:08, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Citation of stats issues

Alright, I'll give what I know about the citations... but I think it needs verifying or looking into. These are trickier because they are scattered.

• Name (Japanese): 地場まもる Chiba Mamoru

Pretty sure we can use the materials collection for this one, primary manga reference would be act 3, where he introduces himself on the bus.

• Name (North America): Darien (dub), Darien Shields (English manga)

The Darien Shields needs a reference, I think again act 3, Mixx manga, mines off across the country though. --;;

• Senshi alias: Tuxedo Mask

Materials Collection, probably second appearance? maybe first. She had a habit of coming up with titles and attacks late.

• Birthday: August 3

First appearance, was the first time that Usagi and Mamoru had a little spat in volume 6? It's the act where she asks about his birthday and then they *at least* have a heavy make out session. 'cause his shirt came off. Was mentioned in the Materials collection too.

• Astrological sign: Leo

Not directly mentioned, unless in Materials Collection. But not hard to figure out either based on previous birthday.

• Blood type: A I'm sure this is mentioned.. maybe Materials Collection, maybe fan book, maybe act 3 or 4?

• Favorite colors: Black

That might be an anime book thing.. Got it from Ken Aromdee. I don't remember it showing up in the manga off hand.

• Hobbies: reading

I can't remember where this came from. I'm pretty sure it said reading, not reading books.

• Favorite food: Chocolate

I'm pretty sure this showed up manga side, but I can't remember where... maybe it was a side story, probably in anime guide books too.

• Favorite subject: Physics

Ken Aromdee... don't remember it in the manga.. might be somewhere.

• Least favorite food: None

Anime books?

• Worst subject: None

I think this is a Takeuchi-sensei thing, again, I blank from where.. Ken Aromdee also has it in his FAQ, but there must be a base source.

• Has trouble with: other people arguing (anime)

Not officially listed manga... needles was mentioned in the episode with Ami. Ironically this is a theme in a lot of Toei male characters who end up wearing pink shirts... Goku wore a pink shirt once and he was afraid of needles as well. ^_^ First appearance of having trouble with arguing shows up in the curry episode of SMR and in the manga volume 10 back matter a picture done by Ikuko Itoh where he's sweat dropping and doesn't know what to do.

• Dreams: To protect the Earth with Usagi (manga), to become a doctor (anime)

Dream in the manga, I think it was supported in the act where they got younger and were shown Elysion... the doctor comment can be supported in the manga with the going to medical school, however, this isn't a real established dream, only a hoped profession. In the anime, I think it was the same episode with the needle, but I have a stronger feeling that it had to be later, because I remember he said at one point he didn't know what he wanted to be and had a variety of high-end subjects on his shelf. (I believe this is the episode where he helps them out, but they really wanted to escape the heat).

• Guardian planet: The Earth

Easily supported, anywhere in the dream arc.

• Element: Earth

Also dream arc, may first appear first arc, end of series where he uses his powers to check if the Earth is OK and says it's a little scratched, but the dream arc will have better support... somewhere.

• Height: 173 cm / 5'8"

use same references as the ones in Ami.

• Age: 17-18 to 19-20 (Manga), 20-21 to 22-23 (Anime) throughout main storyline

First age established at Act 3, second age divined by Usagi aging 2 years, and the anime age given by the fact he's said to be a college student, first by Motoki, then stated by the girl that had a crush on him during, I think the Super arc. Note that the age though was a confusion from the manga where there was a character named Endou who was in college and was taken over/killed/disappeared then Mamoru assumed his identity, making him best friends with Motoki, and a college student... since Motoki was already said to be in college by Reika of the manga. Thus Mamoru's backstory was changed anime-side to make him a college student in that *cough* classic green jacket which in the manga looks like a really cool black jacket...

I need episodes though... and to verify sources.. *sighs* and I need to do Nanowrimo too... I have a test tomorrow. --Hitsuji Kinno 09:17, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Comfirmin' your references: Act 3 is right for the names, and Act 1 is right for his title. The Materials Collection doesn't have his birthday, so it must be Volume 6 (which I don't have). When Luna looks him up in Act 4, she doesn't have his birthdate or blood type. The anime talks about how he can't decide which subject to focus on in school, sometime in early S. I can find that if you like. And your age thing is correct! :) The other stuff I don't know off hand. --Masamage 20:02, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

The episode where he says that he's into studying a lot of things is the one where Usagi gets drunk. "Usagi's dance is the Waltz", I think. - Malkinann 12:00, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Right! Thank you. :) ("Mamo-chan to paatii!! Demo, Eigo... Mamo-chan to paatii!! Demo, Eigo...") --Masamage 19:19, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

We just need the rest of the references... In that episode too she asked what their first kiss was... ^^;; Makes a great trivia question because their official first kiss was in an episode that wasn't counted later in the series. If you throw in the curve ball of the first kiss where Kotono Mitsuishi did the voicing, it makes it even more geeky! ^.~ No wonder poor Mamoru is confused. *which one*. They kiss much earlier in the manga. *shrugs* not wikipedia friendly though.--Hitsuji Kinno 01:00, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Hee hee. To say nothing of the Silver Millennium! :D --Masamage 02:44, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Wait! She asked him about their first kiss in the episode where Unazuki was attacked. The "Three-way Battle" episode. -SaturnYoshi ^{THE VOICES} 17:17, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

Hitsuji, which first kiss do you refer to, when you say it wasn't "counted"? In the first season, they kissed on the balcony while she was "drunk" - the English dub turned this into a dream but it was real in the Japanese anime. I always took Mamoru's reticence in the three-way battle episode as realizing he remembers an earlier first kiss than she probably remembers. Anyway, they didn't kiss again in season 1. In season 2, they kiss in episode 60 after their boat trip, and this is a "real" kiss between their civilian identities, sober, with full awareness of each other. She may be assuming that is their first kiss, whereas Mamoru may know otherwise. Episode 44 I count as Prince Endymion and Princess Serenity kissing, not their first kiss as Usagi/Mamoru. Also, there's nothing saying that that is the first time the Prince and Princess kissed (unlikely, to be honest). So I don't take Episode 44 as a first anything. Can you clarify which kiss you were thinking of? (The balcony scene was while Kotono was voicing... Araki was voicing during the Princess Serenity kiss but again that's not a "first" kiss) 72.192.237.134 17:24, 24 December 2006 (UTC) Ismail

[edit] What?

I'm Surprised, No image of Ediymion or Moonlight knight?!?Lego3400: The Sage of Time 20:16, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I'll see if I can stir some up. -- RattleMan 20:17, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

Splicing images together is fun: [1] [2], and [3] [4] singles (so far). -- RattleMan 21:16, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

I like the second one. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lego3400 (talk • contribs).

[edit] Differences between manga and anime

I'm not sure how to put it in the article, but I feel like that the diference in how he acts with the senshi in the two versions isn't really clearly distinguished. The article explicitly says that he often saves Sailor Moon in the nick of time, but in the manga it is more often the other way around at first [then the roles being reversed, isntead of Usagi finally needing to be the one saving him, he feels the need to save her]. I also have some problems with the following things mentioned regarding the manga"

[In Profile:] "After dating for two years, Mamoru gives Usagi a promise ring at an airport. The couple eventually gets married." They never get married, as Mamoru is immediately killed in the manga. Their future selves get married, but even if we consider them the same people a differention should be made. I'm not sure if this happens the same way in the anime.

[In Tuxedo Mask:] "In the manga he starts out as an ordinary thief who is trying to get the Silver Crystal." I don't agree with the characterization of Mamoru as an ordinary thief. He's more searching for the crystal than trying to steal it, and even in the very beginning of the manga he has powers.

Finally, one more. Shouldn't his death be described as a part of profile? It was a very big part of the manga. [Once again, I don't know if he died in the anime.]

Hope I did this right, I don't do much on Wikipedia. Torca

Yes, you did it exactly right. :)

Regarding the thing about them getting married, they are shown get married at the very end of the manga. I'm not sure what you mean by "future selves"--if you mean, say, Neo-Queen Serenity, then I think the timeline goes that she gets married at 16 but doesn't become the Queen until her early 20s. Not sure why I think that, but maybe someone else will corroborate. X) He does die in the anime, though slightly differently--there's a pretty good writeup at Sailor Stars. Anyway, in both cases he gets resurrected and they marry soon after. (I think the ending sequence of ep. 200 has wedding photos?)

The "thief" wording is probably more reflection of how he's seen by the public, rather than who he is. And you're right; this bio needs a lot of help, and we really haven't gotten to it yet. Any help is very appreciated; feel free to give more ideas and to edit the thing yourself. ^^ If you're interested, there's also WikiProject Sailor Moon. --Masamage 08:23, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Ah, well then that differs from the manga, as all of the senshi, including Mamoru, are killed without ressurection. [They are all reborn a millenia later, repeating the events of their previous lives on the moon.] In the final act of the manga there are a few pages showing the future Usagi and Mamoru waking up, with the following dialogue. [Taken from Smile magazine, names changed to their Japanese counterparts]

Usagi: Seems like... ...I was watching a long dream.

Mamoru: What kind of dream?

Usagi: I forgot... [Mamoru]... Can you say it again?

Mamoru: I said it 50 times last night.

Usagi: Just once more...

Mamoru: Last time... Let's get married [Usagi].

It then proceeds to show them getting married. However, as indicated by the dialogue [And the previous acts, which show the senshi being thrown into the Galaxy Cauldron to be recycled], these are merely reincarnations of their former selves echoing the movements of their 20th century selves. [It also might suggest that the entire Sailor Moon series was just a dream, but it seems more likely that it was just remembering what had happened.] I never feel comfortable making big edits like this, though, since my grammar and English skills are poor. Torca 00:45, 23 December 2006 (UTC)

the photos look like they were taken a few days after episode 200 and there are no wedding photos sailor cuteness-ready for love 17:52, 22 December 2006 (UTC)

First, sailor cuteness, I indented your comment. I didn't edit it. I wanted to reply to Torca's comment without confusing people as to where yours belonged. Now, regarding Torca's comment... I haven't personally read the end of Stars, only heard reports of it, but there's something I'd like to check. I've always been given the understanding that normally they WOULD have been recycled, but that Usagi triumphed and managed to rescue them in their present lives. They're still Usagi and Mamoru, for one thing, and all the questions as to whether Chibi-Usa would be born or not would be moot if Chibi-Usa was from a future incarnation of them rather than their future selves... one or both of them dying wouldn't put her existence into question since it would depend on future lives after they had died anyway. Neo-Queen Serenity also met Usagi in the manga and did act as though she was that same Usagi once a thousand years ago (not reincarnated and distinct). I must admit it also makes me feel more like they just won hard-fought happiness if it isn't a case of their lives actually ending to start all over again. However, perhaps the fact is that that final scene is just so... hazy?... that it's easy to interpret either way. I realize what Usagi says, but I thought that was either being asleep for a while, skipping over seeing him ask, or living for just long enough in happiness together as to have the natural impulse of "wow, such and such time in my life is over." I'm just curious... do we have facts about that last part or interpretation? 72.192.237.134 13:16, 28 December 2006 (UTC) Ismail

"Facts?" no. I could look for a third party interpertation, I suppose. But it seems to me that the manga had been hinting at it for quite some time. First of all, we know that they rule 30th Century Tokyo at their same ages, but it's never stated exactly how they got eternal youth. Also, and this is a big one that doesn't occur in the anime. both Diamond and Pluto [pre-mortem, of course] say that the exact same thing from different times cannot interact or BOOM. Pluto sacrifices her life to stop it from happening with the silver crystal. However, Usagi and her future self [though it's advised against for the BOOM reason] meet, hold hands, and talk a bit, indicating that they are not in fact the same person.

As for the final scenes. Moon asks for everyone's help, to lend her their power. They do so, and we see that sailor crystals have gathered around her, her dead friends' souls. It rips Chaos apart, and ChibiChibi turns into Cosmos. The starseeds ask her if their Princess has sacrificed her life, and Cosmos says, "Your princess has been regenerated like all the other Senshi. Eventually, they will arrive in the 30th century." ... "Eternal Sailor Moon tried to hold down Chaos... ...and melted ino the Cordon with Chaos." A confusing scene is probably where Cosmos tells everyone to return to their home. However, as she was talking to Chibi-usa's future protectors, I take it to mean that they were just reincarnated in a more appropriate time period. Sailor Moon is able to keep her true shape within the Cordon. Sailor Cosmos' fairy starseed mentions Sailor Moon's mother coming to grant her child a new life, and then asks her if she wants to become a star, or be reincarnated as she is : a senshi. Of course, they all say they want to live together, and POOF 30th century. That's my interpretation, at least. Torca 07:06, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

You see the problem, then? You can say that there's an interpretation like that, but unless the scene is quite factually clear on the matter, you can't say that's what definitely happened. You mention how Usagi and Neo-Queen Serenity met briefly... however, they still mentioned the "risk" even then, and even Neo-Queen Serenity felt there was a risk but wanted to meet Usagi... and they kept it brief. If they are advised of the "boom," then it's still relevant even if it doesn't happen... otherwise they wouldn't have been advised of it. Then there's still the fact that Chibiusa seems dependent on Usagi/Mamoru being okay. The other thing is... they all say they want to be together.... but I've always thought that you experienced a *time jump* then. In the manga, isn't Chibiusa technically supposed to be 900some years old, and Crystal Tokyo having been around for a long time by the time she's as old as she is during the Nemesis stuff? Well, that would mean that after the Cauldron stuff goes down, that Naoko jumped forward a little in time to let you see that they were now in the Crystal Palace... but Crystal Tokyo had existed for a long time, so it wasn't necessarily the 30th century yet... and ChibiUsa was conceived.... and in the 30th century she's 900some in age. I have no problem with things that can be stated as facts being stated as such, but it seems to me that... if nothing else.... NEITHER you or I can be sure about saying that those two are or aren't Usagi and Mamoru as fact. The article might talk about how that's an interpretation that exists (pointing to a third pary intepretation that cites what you mention) but that things are not certain as written in the manga itself. You know? We have to be careful to put verifiable stuff here and to mention any interpretation as interpretation. That goes for all of us. 72.192.237.134 15:49, 31 December 2006 (UTC)Ismail

Well, permanent or not, he still dies, which is [in my opinion] pretty important. The discussion of the ending doesn't really belong on Mamoru's page, but on the Stars Series' page it might be worthwhile to note the two different interpretations of the ending. Torca 21:20, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

If you mean he dies at the airport, yes, he does. I never even mentioned that. All I'm saying is that *all* of Wikipedia has to keep to verifiable facts and note *any* interpretations as such. Since the ending is really quite abstract on this point, unless some place has been able to factually spell it out (from the author) it *is* just a matter of interpretation and the interpretations of it should be noted *as* interpretations. Anyway, all I'm saying is that the article shouldn't take interpretation as fact - which is policy anyway. I'm sure we've agreed on that, though, so cheers. 72.192.237.134 22:50, 31 December 2006 (UTC) Ismail

[edit] Stats from article

Instead of putting these into prose, I'm just copying them here for now so that they can be sourced first. Once we have those, I'll work 'em back in. :) The Sailor Moon FAQ also has a good list. --Masamage 01:49, 12 January 2007 (UTC)

• Blood type: A
• Favorite colors: Black
• Hobbies: reading books
• Favorite food: Chocolate
• Least favorite food: None
• Favorite subject: Physics
• Worst subject: None
• Has trouble with: other people arguing (anime), getting needles (anime episode 97)
• Dreams: To protect the Earth with Usagi (manga), to become a doctor (anime)
• Height: 173 cm / 5'8"
• Age: 17-18 to 19-20 (Manga), 20-21 to 22-23 (Anime) throughout main storyline

According to Mamoru Chiba's profile on Moon Prism Box (first manga arc based)... ~ Fighter4luv 00:55, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

• Hobby: Reading
• Dream: Doctor
• Weak Points: Giving in to Usagi's crying? (うさぎの泣きおとし)
• Age: 17 years old
• School: year 2, Private Azabu Senior High School? (私立元麻布高校二年)
• Protection Star: The Earth

What's a Moon Prism Box? --Masamage 00:58, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

It's the official Bishojo Senshi Sailor Moon online source. All in Japanese so it took me a while to translate all their profiles ^_^ It's a new feature on the Sailormoon channel website. ~ Fighter4luv 01:02, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Ohhhh, that thing! I didn't even try. XD Okay, awesome. His manga age, at least, can go in right now, once we figure out how to source that ref. (Strange...in the manga, his and Usagi's age difference is actually slightly less than mine and my husband's. O_o) --Masamage 01:17, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Hehe. What was the reason for making Mamoru older in the anime. Apparently your site says in his twenties... I have no idea what year of College he is in... but he would only be around 19-20 in the first season....?? *shrugs shoulders* ~ Fighter4luv 07:51, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

I believe he's a freshman, which, assuming he was 17 as a second-year high school student (the equivalent of 11th grade in a US high school), would make him 19. Of course that is just a guess. --Masamage 20:50, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] vandalism

i just removed some vandlism saying in a random part "is king of the queers" i was wondoring if the one who put it in should get a vandilsum warning or somthing? sailor cuteness-ready for love 21:11, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

i just removed more saying hes a prostute is there any way to get whoevers doing this banned ?sailor cuteness-ready for love 21:21, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

this stuped vandle i removed some vile comments from the pgsm section who ever doing this removed the whole section i dont know how to put it back sorry sailor cuteness-ready for love 21:29, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

I gave him a {{test1}}. We do not block if the user has not been warned, unless there is a serious risk for Wikipedia. And vandalizing a single article is not really very serious because it can be reverted by editing an old version of the article. -- ReyBrujo 21:42, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

oh ok i got all the vandalizing but il revert it because of the pgsm info that has gone missing i didnt see that you allredy did it thanks :} sailor cuteness-ready for love 21:46, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

should we lock this page because it gets vandalised a lot♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 15:50, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

Can I just say that there's a bit more vandalism in the moonlight night part just so you know, it didn't show up when I went to edit it but it is there to read. (Sam) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.79.41.75 (talk • contribs).

it gets reverted quickly but i think it needs to be locked im not sure how to and i wouldent unless evreyone agrees ♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 17:57, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I reported the recent gang of vandals and they have been indefinitely blocked. I think we can hold off for now, but if it gets hit again I can put it up for a semi-protect. --Masamage 19:11, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I wonder why this piticular page gets vandalised all the time poor Mamoru ♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 19:39, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I think it's the same person or small group, disgruntled that we keep reverting them. Since it hasn't stopped and has switched to a new IP, I've requested semiprotection. --Masamage 19:02, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

yay then cute mamoru can get a brake ♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 19:45, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

It was denied. :/ But I reported the individual vandal. So we'll see what happens. --Masamage 21:30, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

hopefuly the vandles/trolls will get bored and get a life ♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 21:35, 10 February 2007 (UTC)

Is it the same guy each time? its driving me insane he did it like 5 times today--♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 19:07, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

I think so, because the IP is only changing a little bit each time. That's enough that blocking him won't help, though. I've made the request again. --Masamage 19:50, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

I hope it gets accsepted this time mamo-chan gets vandalised evrey day--♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 20:11, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Bam! It went through. :D For a good long time, too. Should be enough for them to get bored and give up. --Masamage 20:53, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

mabye long enough for them to descover a new web site or god forebid the outside world ♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 20:55, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] unblock

unblock it now! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 81.145.240.230 (talk) 13:58, 16 February 2007 (UTC).

because of reacent vandulism this page is locked to new wikipedia if you would like to talk about the edit you want to make use my talk page user:Sailor cuteness ♥sailor cuteness-ready for love♥ 14:04, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Images

• Anime or Manga Endymion
• Pgsm Endymion
• PGSM Dark Endymion
• Anime or Manga King Endymion
• Moonlight Knight
• Replace Manga image with civillan manga image.

Thats all i think we need...Lego3400: The Sage of Time 02:52, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

We don't need all of those, I don't think. Just one Prince Endymion should be sufficient; there's not a whole lot of variation. --Masamage 04:33, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

PGSM is diffrent and we need one of the king...Lego3400: The Sage of Time 21:48, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

I have issues with all three of the images you just added. The PGSM one is bleached out, the King one is busy with other stuff, and the Moonlight Knight one is cropped out of something that's still invading at the edges--besides which it's incorrectly licensed, because that is not a screenshot, it's a clipping from a magazine we'll never be able to find and source. The first and last need to be replaced and I am still not convinced that we need King Endymion or can justify such an image as fair use. --Masamage 20:41, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Here's a thought: using the same image on Usagi's and Mamoru's articles. --Masamage 21:53, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Okay, I found a cleaner image for Moonlight Knight and put that up, plus a much less grainy shot of Prince Endymion. It's still too white for my tastes, but at least it's easier to see him. Took forever to find, though; nobody cares about the poor guy. --Masamage 02:50, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Another thing we need to do, in order to match the other profiles, is replace that manga shot of Tuxedo Mask with a manga shot of Mamoru himself. I'm having an awful time finding a good one, though. --Masamage 02:51, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

What about a picture of a manga attack because he dosnt use any manga attacks in anime ♥Eternal Pink-ready for love♥ 16:59, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

Mayyybe.... Let's hold off on that one under we get this page reorganized, 'cause then it'll be easier to tell if there's a proper place for it. --Masamage 22:21, 2 March 2007 (UTC)