Talk:Pesticide
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This page is a good start but needs a lot of expansion considering it is such an important topic. We should really try to check the POV on the large chunk of (well written) text added by an anonymous ip who is most likely from the pesticide industry. We dont want this page to be a propaganda party. We need more on the environmental effects of pesicides, and we should consider merging some info from other articles. Fred, see the definition of pest which i added to the beginning of the article.Bonus Onus 04:27, Mar 10, 2005 (UTC)
Could it be possible to isolate american policy from general discussion over pesticide consideration ? Anthère
It is a pleasure to contribute to what was already a good start as noted by Bonus Onus. I have tried to improve the text on pesticide dangers by modifying material that direct experience with the US regulatory process tells me is controversial or POV. For some specific examples, I changed "prove" to "indicate" where it was said that the US regulatory process requires that pesticides must be proven to be safe, and "scientifically sound risk assessments" to "scientifically based risk assessments." The latter change is due to the fact that the science that goes into these risk assessments is often marginal, and the final conclusions of US EPA risk assessments have been documented to be affected by political pressure. But to bash the science and conclusions that hard would have been to unnecessarily bias the discussion towards my opinion, so I have tried to use neutral terms. Interested readers should be given links to some case studies so they can form their own opinions, but I don't have those at hand.
I also tried to make the text less consumer-centric. For example, the dangers of pesticides section didn't include dangers to workers, and that is a big omission, because although not very well off and small in numbers relative to consumers, they are often badly impacted. I didn't touch much of the text on pesticide residues except to change the term "residual pesticides" to its more common arrangement, "pesticide residues." I have to do some homework on pesticide residues first, but after I do, I will be able to provide a bit more text on that subject fairly easily.
Finally, Anthère's request that the US-centricness woven into the article should be isolated seems completely fair, and I would be willing to tackle the separation at some point. My thought is that the section on pesticide regulation should have most of this material, and it should have subsections for various countries or blocks that regulate pesticides. On the other hand, the US has traditionally been a leader both in the use and regulation of pesticides, and many other countries have followed the US regulatory model and specific decisions, so the US-centricness is more generally applicable than it might seem. Brian Hill 01:37 Nov 13, 2005 (UTC)
At the moment the article seems to be biased against the use of pesticides with little on either the benefits of their use or the regulatory controls in place to control their use and ensure their safety. To start of saying 'Pesticides are usually, but not always, poisonous to humans' is emotive and misleading. Many pesticides have remarkably low acute toxicity and are no more toxic than a wide range of other chemicals we use. Cases of poisoning attributed to pesticides in the developed world are extremely rare these days. The section on regulation seems to concentrate on illegal use and the banning of particularly hazardous pesticides. I would like to see more on the systems in place to ensure safety to opertors, consumers and the environment (I work for a regulatory authority btw). A more balanced view (I believe) is to minimise the use of pesticides but to recognise their benefits. I have added links to the US and UK regulatory authorities and the European Commission plant health pages, all of which contain large amounts of information, and there are many other simialr websites.
Regarding Brian Hill's assertation that the "US-centricness" is more generally applicable I would urge caution. There are some substantial differences between the US and European systems. I believe the US system does not require a pesticide to be effective only to meet safety standards. In Europe pesticides can only be approved if there is an overall benefit to their use. This is a large area If I can find the time I will try and add an overview of the current European system. Maccheek 10:10, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
If I may make a suggestion...I must admit I was dissapointed by this page. I stumbled upon this page looking for information about pesticides and discovered that there was scant little information in this article about pesticides themselves. What are the specific pesticides that are currently used? What are their chemical structures? How do they work? How are they used? Why are they used? This information is almost completely lacking. I'm not sure if the article names a single modern pesticide aside from DDT. Organophosphate pesticides and organochlorine pesticides are mentioned, but not explained. The sections about regulation, dangers, etc, are quite good but the lack of anything else makes the whole article appear unbalanced.
I read this article and learned almost nothing about pesticides, except for the fact that the authors of this article don't like pesticides. And statements like "Pesticides are tools of convenience" and "Reducing the use of pesticides and replacing high risk pesticides is the ultimate solution to reducing risks placed on our society from pesticide use." don't appear very neutral to me, it's a policy suggestion. Pmw2cc.
- Follow the links in the 'Types of pesticide' section of the page, most have long lists of specific pesticides.sbandrews 23:53, 25 August 2006 (UTC)
Contents |
[edit] Definition of pesticide
The inclusion of herbicides within the concept pesticide is troublesome to an English speaker because pest = bug. Fred Bauder 19:24, 25 Oct 2003 (UTC)
- This is standard language among manufactuers, farmers, acadamia, and government regulators. Herbicides and insecticides are considered subsets of pesticides... -Nydigoveth
Do insect repellents (DEET, etc) count as pesticides? Bonus Onus 15:33, Mar 12, 2005 (UTC)
The definition of "pesticide" is as something that kills, not as something that attracts or repels or does anything but kill. This is the definition in use for Category:Insecticides and Insecticide I'm wondering if a similar "killing only" definition would be appropriate here and in Category:Pesticides. With regard to the question about DEET, there is an obscure term, "insectifuge" which means "insect repellent" and I'm considering creating Category:Insect repellents Category:Insectifuges. I recently created (please don't laugh ... even though I did when I made it) Category:Human-animal conflict into which I could put Category:Insecticides but not Category:Pesticides, which leaves things like DEET out in the cold, having to be added to the "conflict" category article-by-article, which I don't find savory. Courtland 02:59, July 25, 2005 (UTC)
I got rid of "control, attract or repel" in the definition of pesticide. According to standard definitions (e.g., [http://www.dictionary.com/), it is indeed something that kills pests, as already noted by Courtland. Also, "-cide" is a Latin suffix meaning "kill." There is already a broader term that covers other ways of dealing with pests: "integrated pest management." Brian Hill 03:00, Nov 13, 2005 (UTC)
I replaced existing definition with EPA's definition because they are the lead US agency and pesticides do more than just kill. Ozdog 22:31, 8 January 2006 (UTC)
The European regulatory system uses the term 'Plant Protection Product' to include products such as fungicides, herbicides, insecticides, repellants, bio-control agents and plant growth regulators. Maccheek 10:10, 11 January 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Biopesticides
A biopesticide is different from pesticides because instead of depending on chemical substances to control undesired species, it uses other orgamisms to control them, for example: a mushroom spore that if eaten by an insect it affects it's digestive system, leading to it's death. Later on the developed mushrooms are either easy to remove or non-harmful to humans.
This reduces the human health risk, but doesn't reduce the damage to the ecosystem, since it still kills an species and adds another one.
[edit] Dangers of pesticides
Anyone know of scientific studies (with verifiable sources) that can be added to support claims that pesticide use is harmful to humans (e.g. kids and pregnant women)? I've noticed that large studies in both the US (i.e. the Agricultural Health Study) and Canada (by the National Cancer Institute of Canada) have been done that failed to find any evidence of, at least cancer risk, and non are referenced in this article (yet).
What would also be useful would be a description of what tests a proposed pesticide would have to fail to be refused government (e.g. EPA) approval, and what they have to fail to be approved but only under close regulation. the link in the article is to a pesticides critical site and should probably replaced or balanced with something more neutral.
this link is in the organic food article, but is mostly concerned with effects of direct pesticide exposure. i would be also interested in studies that whether pesticide residues in food are dangerous, or better a summary of studies.
- Extensive Press Release on Pesticides from the Ontario College of Family Physicians
--trueblood 15:37, 6 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Plant Growth Regulators?
Removed : "* Plant Growth Regulators [1] for the modification of plant growth (examples: prevention of lodging in wheat, earlier initiation of flowering, production of larger table grapes and stimulation of root growth of cuttings)"
- because these agents are not directed against a specific "pest". Ekem 23:10, 19 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] External links
Added a link to pesticideinfo.org. I would like to acknowledge that linking to pesticideinfo.org is self-promotion. I am a maintainer of that site. However, to verify that it is a significant resource, try web searches for specific pesticides, such as chlorpyrifos, methyl isothiocyanate, or chloropicrin, for example, and note pesticideinfo.org's ranking. Also, I removed the badly formatted and incorrectly placed croplifeamerica.org link from the external links to regulatory agencies. I will add a well-formatted link to croplifeamerica.org. Brian Hill 23:52, 25 April, 2006 (PDT)
[edit] Merge with article "Protectant"
Under "Types of pesticides" I propose the content in "Protectant" be merged with "Pesticides". Tmchk 19:09, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
I do not agree with the proposal, the subject of natural protectants deserves its own page. sbandrews 20:12, 7 August 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps we could have a section in Pesticides, that briefly describes protectants and then says something like, "see main article on protectants". Tmchk 03:23, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
Either way, I think the section "Types of pesticides" could be improved. I'll try to add an introduction to the section so it isn't just a list, or if it is a list, it's purpose relates better to the overall subject. Tmchk 03:29, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Globalise?
Would it be possible to get a definition that isn't specific to the USA? The article seems to be centred around pesticides in America (the diagram is of America as well) Does anyone else think I should add a {{globalise}} tag? (or is it jus me being... um... me) Michael Billington (talk • contribs) 02:28, 8 August 2006 (UTC)
I agree that this article is US specific, though I do not think it needs a globalize tag. We could add something about DDT being banned in Africa. Tmchk 17:00, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
- Is it "banned" in Africa? It might be banned for agricultural use, but the WHO is very specific on its availability for use in public health. See the malaria page. Reports about DDT and banning should be handled with care - there's a lot of misinformation out there. Cheers, --Plumbago 17:25, 9 August 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Editoral Errors
The sentence using source 5 as a reference was wrong - someone had misread the source. The quote is "Organophosphates have gained popularity worldwide in preference to organochlorines, which are persistent and more damaging to the environment."
I have changed the sentence to reflect this error. source is reproduced below for convience!
[edit] Errors
In "Managing pesticides" the author is confused over the term "tankmixing". The word pesticides encompasses herbicides, fungicides and insecticides. The term does NOT mean the application of 2 different insecticides as this would be pointless and even illegal. If the insect is resistant to one insecticide you would not then apply it with another insecticide, you would simply use an effective product. No insecticide has a permit for application with another insecticide. "Tankmixing" means applying a herbicide (one or more), possibly with a fungicide (one or more), possibly with an insecticide. Mixes are carefully regulated.
In "Continuing development" the author is quick to point the finger at "agribusiness", implying that small farmers are everyone's friends and use fewer insecticides. This enables us to see the real reason for anti-pesticide sentiment - anti business / technology rather than because pesticides are dangerous. Tomcrisp7 11:00, 26 November 2006 (UTC)
