Talk:Possessive of Jesus

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since nothing really links here, and it treats the same issue as Jesu, couldn't it be merged there, or maybe to a title inflection of Jesus or similar? Also, is "Jesu heart", or any other genitive construction with Jesu really used in English , at all? It is common in German, but German hasn't lost its case system; In Modern English, I only ever found Jesu used as vocative; Not even the 1611 KJV uses Jesu. Wycliffe (that's Middle English) does use Jhesu, but I haven't found an instance of 'naked' genitive along the lines of 'Jesu heart' even there; Wycliffe would say 'the hearte of Jhesu'. I grant you that the vocative is fairly common, but I suspect even that was re-imported via the Bach cantata, since KJV never uses Iesu, even in the vocative. What is called "Herz Jesu" in German is known as 'Sacred Heart' in English. Can you quote any English hymn or prayer that talks about "Jesu heart"? 83.76.218.123 21:33, 22 October 2005 (UTC)

I've always heard it pronounced Jesus's, although it's usually written Jesus'. Fowler (1940) says "In verse, and in poetic or reverential contexts, this custom [formerly, when a singular ended in -s] is retained, and the number of syllables is the same as in the subjective case, e.g. Achilles' has three, not four; Jesus' or of Jesus, not Jesus's." So does Jesus' really have only two syllables, or is it a confusing archaism? 80.44.157.33 14:02, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

It's not an archaism: the modern spelling is Jesus', and it is pronounced as two syllables, indistinct from the name itself. The addition to the name of the apostophe, without a trailing s, signifies that it shouldn't be pronounced as three syllables. In modern English, apostrophe-only possesives are usually only formed for plural nouns where the plural ends in s (e.g. busses', but women's). This also applies to names -- Mrs Thomas's car (Thomas's is three syllables), but the Thomases' family car (still three syllables). However, there is a tradition that certain 'classical' names that end in s break this rule: they add apostrophe only in the singular and do not add an extra syllable -- Socrates' cup and Jesus' disciples. --Gareth Hughes 17:40, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Certainly the pronunication of 's would add an extra syllable, but that is exactly how the possessive is spoken in everyday English, that is, outside the poetic and reverential contexts which Fowler refers to. One might say Achilles' heel, but never Marcus' hat, which has less to do with the history of the words and more to do with the phonetics. Colloquially the possessive of the nominative Jesus is spoken as three syllables, best represented as Jesus's. I have never heard the allegedly 'correct' possessive pronounced as two syllables. That tradition may have died; it's just taking a while for the written possessive to catch up.

86.132.113.250 15:41, 12 January 2006 (UTC)

Frankly, it seems clear to me that "Jesus's" is a correct possessive. I see no reason why this particular name would not be treated the same as any other name ending in "s" -- I mean, James' and James's are both correct. Does anyone see any real reason for this article to exist at all? kdogg36 00:59, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article states opinion as fact

The raw claim of this article that Jesus' is the correct way to form the possessive in English and that Jesus's is simply incorrect is a flat contradiction of reality. Even if there were sources cited here, it must be acknowledged that English usage on this point varies. Acsenray 18:23, 12 July 2006 (UTC)