Talk:Sweet potato

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1 Photo
2 Kumar/Kumara
3 POV
4 the "yum" hypothesis
5 Skin color
6 Stats and POV text
7 origin of the sweet potato
8 Sweet Potato Awareness
9 Use in potato cannons
10 Sweet Potato Pie / Batata Studios

[edit] Photo

Sure about that photo? Sweet potato leaves tend to be heart-shaped. Perhaps you have a yam photo.

Sweetpotato leaf shapes are as varied as the root skin and flesh color. I have grown many sweetpotato varieties in my garden, and few of them have heart-shaped leaves. I have grown one with purple-skin and white flesh with heart-shaped leaves (Kotobuki). Those having leaves that are not heart-shaped display a variety of what I term "notched" but described as "palmately lobed" in the wiki text. These have included Vardaman (orange skin, orange flesh), Okinawan (white skin, magenta flesh), and Purple (purple skin, purple flesh). I have photographed them and include them on my web page at http://home.usmo.com/~dougyounkin/sweetpotatoes.html. --Dougyounkin 17:45, 1 February 2006 (UTC)what is it a sweet potato are good

[edit] Kumar/Kumara

I'd appreciate a reference on the kumar/kumara. I remember the story being a bit more complicated. Diderot 20:55, 14 Mar 2005 (UTC)

[edit] POV

The text says Sweet potatoes are believed to have originated in South America and spread throughout the tropical Americas into the Caribbean and across the South Pacific to Easter Island. Very likely the tuber drifted across the sea just as coconuts and some other plants still do today.

All other texts I have found on the Internet say that it is impossible for sweet potatoes to drift across the sea. They would rot long before they arrived at Easter Island. See for instance [1], [2] and [3].

Because the general Polynesian word for the sweet potato is kumara, and the South American word is kumar, it was originally thought that this was evidence of cross-Pacific contact between South America and Polynesia. However, linguists have determined that kumara and kumar are totally unrelated and have nothing to do with each other. This therefore cannot be considered as evidence of pre-Magellan trans-Pacific crossings.

I would really like a reference for this "linguistic" assertion. It would only be possible to rule out that it is the same word, if and only if, the name kumara can be determined to have appeared in Polynesian before an important sound change. Loan words, such as kumara possibly is do not lend themselves to such categorical conclusions. According to this site, it is the same word in South America and Polynesia [4]. I strongly suspect that we have a POV crusader against transoceanic crossings at Wikipedia.--Wiglaf 10:28, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I suspect rather less malicious intent, but everything I remember about the sweet potato problem suggests that it's more complicated than this article says. The "linguistic proof" that the words are unrelated is the one that sticks in my gaw, since the whole idea of linguists "proving" that the word isn't related to the one used in South America is a tad bizarre. The more I trawl the web on it, the more confused it gets. It's possible that only the radicals are writing webpages though. The DNA research is a bit weird too. I'd have to do some paper research to do it justice, and I haven't the time.

It's not that simple, either the for case or the against. Frakly, the whole business seems to attract enough crackpots that even if the crackpots are right, you still don't want to have much to do with them.

Diderot 13:31, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I agree with Diderot about the complexity, the crackpots, and the time constraints.

I believe that the South American origin is undisputed, and the controversy has only to do with how the sweet potato came to be used in Polynesia.

I removed the statement about "kumara" because this seems to be exactly one of the points debated. I'm sure a more complete treatment would reinclude it, but with more detail and sources. We should explain, at least, that there are variations in the Polynesian forms, and explain which South American languages, among the hundreds, use this word.

Pekinensis 18:56, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Sure. I hope someone can fill it in with a relevant discussion. I just read this article [5] and it is a nice article. However, he seems a bit too eager to debunk the hypotheses. Especially the part about the Kensington runestone was a little too hasty. I don't believe that the Kensington runestone is authentic, but the debunking is not as easy or as straightforward as he claims.--Wiglaf 19:31, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)

As far as I know, the "american" kumara word is from quechuan origin. This ambiguity should be mentioned in the article, and also in the disambiguation page, where it is stated that it is a maori word, without any mention to the american word. Perhaps it would be better to say that kumara refers to the sweet potato (in the disambiguation page), and in this page extend a little bit over the controversy (but not left it out). Also, even though I don't know nothing about the history of the sweet potato, it is considered a fact that it has an american origin, and that it spread to New Zealand in relatively recent times (1.000 years would qualify as recent, considering that americans grew the plant for 5.000 years). Given that fact, it is difficult for me to mantain that the name wouldn't have migrated along with the plant. The coincidence, on the other hand, seems very unlikely to me.

[edit] the "yum" hypothesis

Can anyone point to a reliable source for ..."'yams' (originally expressed as "yum" by the Native American Indian when they were first introduced to them by the Spaniards)." I question its reliability." Liblamb 20:46, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

I had understood that story to be false. True yams are native to Africa, not America. --Diderot 21:09, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

I removed it. -- WormRunner | Talk 22:02, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Skin color

I believe "light red or tan" is too narrow (and doesn't even cover the photo in the article), but I'm not good with color descriptions, and my judgments have been called into question in the past, so I've collected some photos:

What about "ranging between red, purple, white, and brown"?

— Pekinensis 19:18, 17 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Stats and POV text

Some queries:

Is it correct to refer to China as a 'developing country'? - I'd have said not
Is there any reason the 11th largest producer is singled out for detailed description, when the 2nd-10th largest producers aren't even mentioned? - this stinks POV to me. I'd suggest deleting the para about the 11th largest producer, and giving more info on the 2nd-5th largest producers
The production figure for China should be checked - the text here gives 105,000 tonnes, but the FAO stat link referenced gives 105,197,100 tonnes, a thousand times as much. But equally, the FAO figure does seem extraordinary compared to the other large producers (2nd largest, Uganda, 2,650,000 tonnes, only 2½% of what they say China produces), I suspect there may be a typo on the FAO stats. Can anyone confirm? - MPF 21:34, 3 September 2005 (UTC)

I'd say the point about the category is irrelevant, since China carries the story quite well by itself, and I have removed the phrase.
I think parochialism might be a better word than POV. I originally left the paragraph there because I prefer to address this sort of problem by adding information rather than removing it, but on reconsideration I have removed it for lack of references, especially for the volume of the US, Canadian, and European markets.
I believe the discrepancy is simply a typo on my part, and I have fixed it to conform to the FAO number, which I agree is amazing enough to demand scrutiny. I did not find demonstrably independent corroboration, but the FAO stats for China are at least internally consistent, showing only a modest decrease over the past ten years. [6]. — Pekinensis 19:59, 8 September 2005 (UTC)

[edit] origin of the sweet potato

1 excuse my poor english 2 about the name kumara : actually its not kumara in all polynesian languages but 'umara in tahitian, kuma'a in marquesan and 'uala in Hawaian (apparently a consoun was droped in the process) and 'umala in the Samoa. The evolution of the word, parallel to other words, suggest a protopolynesian origin : if the word had been borrowed from south america by polynesian at the late time of the colonisation of Pascua, could it have evoluted through all polynesia like an ancient word ? I think that the hawaian people would have heard instead : "kumala". Does somebody have links about that question ? according to (http://www.plantnames.unimelb.edu.au/Sorting/Ipomoea.html)Kuara exist also in NZ and in Niue, next to kumara you have simala, suggesting a mara root with ku or si prefixes ??? but the page does not give papuan names 3 Sweet potato is cultivated in all polynesia but also in melanesia and papooasia ! what about the names there ??? if the SP came from South America, had it the time to jump back to Papuasia ? links ? in the page quoted the fijian name is : kumara but other names compare it to yam (wa uvi) 4 does the the "spanish" name camote come from chamorro or which other language of asia ? 5 about the origin of plants : the origin of cultivated plants is not a mathematical issue. well known plants have no known origin, for exemple in polynesia : coconut trees ! the "mistery" of transport of the SP from america to polynesia exists only if you BELIEVE that this plant originated solely from america. (I dont know if I am clear enough ?) 5 " There is great confusion about how and when Sweet Potatoes came to be cultivated on the Pacific Islands in Polynesia, Micronesia and Melanesia. Their use on these islands seems to pre-date their possible introduction by European explorers but how this came about has not been fully resolved." I quote that good sentence to which I would add Papuasia, from http://www.museums.org.za/bio/plants/convolvulaceae/ipomoea_batatas.htm !

stefjourdan@caramail.com

I think it's cool to leave it as a mystery. But for me it's clear that sweet potato cultivation swept around the world from West to East right after 1492, that is starting in the West Indies then Europe and Africa, Asia, the Pacific. One big problem for me with Polynesia having them earlier is how to explain why they did not go the other direction from there. Steve Dufour 15:34, 2 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sweet Potato Awareness

Since my link was removed, I'm supposed to talk about this here instead of re-adding it.

Yes, I'm affiliated with Sweet Potato Awareness Month, but I don't make any money off of it, I'm just trying to spread the word. I think it's entirely relevant.

I have flyers to download for people to print and pass out if they're as weird as I am about the difference between yams and sweet potatoes.

You can also find sweet potato recipes and information links there.

I don't see any harm in it. There are already links to sweet potato growers associations, properly so I think, and they make a profit. I will put your link back in.Steve Dufour 15:40, 1 December 2006 (UTC)p.s. It seems to me that sweet potatoes are one of the few things in the world that are not controversal. I have never heard anyone say anything bad about them.

[edit] Use in potato cannons

I yanked the following text from 'Origin and distribution', where it does not belong:

For reasons that are not yet explained, the sweet potato does not make an effective subsitution for a normal potato in a potato cannon. It could be because it has trouble cocking with the more diamond-shaped vegetable, and it could be that a sweet potato is softer.

If this text belongs in the article at all, it belongs under 'Uses'. I leave it to you to decide whether to put it there. eritain 01:43, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Sweet Potato Pie / Batata Studios

Why nothing on sweet potato pie? It is known to me as an African-American ethnic dish, very similar to pumpkin pie. I've only had it a couple of times. What I had was sweeter than pumpkin pie, and maybe not as mushy. Appearance and spiciness were similar to pumpkin pie. Surely the sweet potato people will have some good information about the pie.

The Batata Studios link seems to be spam. Nothing to do with the potato that I can see. Just a guy whose name is similar. Lou Sander 03:22, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

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