Talk:Favela

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"A favela is fundamentally different from a slum or tenement, primarily in terms of how they start, why they start and where they are. However, as Brazil contains a large number of impoverished areas, the word favela is often used to mean any of these types of places. "

This particular part needs attention - how is a favela different from a slum? One can surmise that favelas are generally ad-hoc neighborhoods where the landowner gave no authorization to build, while slums are housing units developed by a third party (or a government) having all rights to the land that falls into a state of disrepair.

[edit] Defining a Favela

Favela can be either a shanty-town or a slum. For example, Rocinha can be considered a slum in many parts -- instead of a shanty town -- but it is a Favela. Check the Rocinha talk page.

The section "Favela society" uses very subjective, stereotypical (perhaps typical), perspective-oriented language. Would be nice to see this section re-worked to be more objective. For example, how prevalent are guns, how many gun deaths are reported, how much money is generated from drug sales. Using exagerrative adjectives without objective figures make this section seem sensationalist or that every favela is the same as portrayed in the worst parts of the film, "City of God".

[edit] A note from someone who lives in brazil

Favelas are much worse than a slum, especially in the north eastern part of Brazil. The houses, if you would like to call them that, are made of garbage and anything they can find. There is no electricity or water. Most people in favelas, either beg for money or get their money with commiting crimes. Not all of them, but it can be generalized this way. It ususally smells like fecal matter and glue in favelas. That's just how bad it is. I'm not even kidding, I live in Brazil, near a favela.

Beep! You just described a "shanty town". In Brazil, it doesn't matter if it is a shanty town or a slum, it is all a favela. Cidade de Deus for example, it is supposed to be a slum. It is not a shanty town because the houses (most of them) were properly constructed, and there is basic sanitation. Nevertheless, it is still a favela: Favela Cidade de Deus (I'm from Rio de Janeiro by the way). --Pinnecco 09:49, 11 July 2005 (UTC)

Here is a perfect description, in portuguese, of how a favela is created (i might translated it latter when I'm inspired)

"A idéia das remoções [de favelas] se tornou maldita porque, nos anos 60, as experiências nesse sentido foram feitas com truculência e sucedidas por total abandono. Os conjuntos habitacionais para onde as famílias foram levadas se degradaram a tal ponto que se transformaram em novas favelas."

So basicaly, it really doesn't matter if its a shanty town or a slum... Even a brand-new development, (such as nice council-hoses), will become a favela if it is socially segregated and abandoned by the government. --Pinnecco 00:25, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

City of God is a good example. It started as an effort by the government to erradicate shanty-towns -- so it can't be considered illegal occupation of a land (don't know if/and until what extension City of God expanded to private lands, though). --Pinnecco 12:51, 14 March 2006 (UTC)

I also live in Brazil, and have a few corrections to make. First, favelas are not a particular Rio phenomenon, rather, they are part of the urban landscape throughout Latin America, especially Brazil. In fact, Sao Paulo's favelas vastly outnumber Rio's, but Rio's American tourists vastly out number Sao Paulo's, leading to this mis-information. Second, most favelas, at least in South-easter Brazil, don't lake electricity, or phone service or satelite TV for that matter. These services are acquired illegally.

(paulo:) I've made some edits based on *alot* of reading, but no first hand experience. Please correct me if I've got anything wrong.

[edit] key issue about favelas in bit cities - high real estate property prices

Rio's favelas aren't entirely made of extreme poverty. In fact, a recent study (need reference for this) showned that rio's favelas inhabitants usually have tv, dvd, refrigerator, air conditioning, and others. To buy an average house in Rocinha it would cost you 25.000 usd dollars (~50.000 reais);

The favela article should remark that favelas aren't only a consequence of poverty, but also a consequence of the extremely high prices of real estate property, specially in the large cities. For the same 25k usd you can buy a large, big and confortable house in any countryside town, but since urbanization in Brazil is too strong, people prefer to live in favelas because near the big centers they have jobs.

A good federal policy for habitation would put down the prices of raw materials and civil construction in general, making the favelas a better place to live. Unfortunately this is yet to happen