Talk:List of electronic music genres

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Contents 1 Hip Hop: Electronic music? 2 new approach 3 Left-Field House 4 Changes and reasoning 5 Slang is not a suitable form of language for encyclopedias 6 Splitting and merging issues 7 Psychadelic? 8 Fixed'd 9 Metallica & UK Psytrance 10 Dance 11 new age: contradiction 12 Intelligent Dance Music 13 Why is there no full on subgenre in psytrance 14 NU-Gaze

[edit] Hip Hop: Electronic music?

Though not traditionally thought of as 'electronic music', most hip hop would fit the defintion. Should it be included on this list? --Frantik 14:47, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

tough call. as you suggest, it could be argued that the majority of hip-hop could fall under the definition of electric music, but on the other hand hip hop was originally based on the use of breaks and vinyl and "the instrumentation of hip-hop is descended from disco, funk, and R&B", and although the use of drum machines and samplers and other digital instrumentation is common in hip hop today i would argue against any specific listing of it's subgenres on this page. although saying that, the hip hop subgenre electro and it's descendants are already listed here. anyway, there already exists List of genres of hip hop, so maybe a mention of that (and to other genres that use digital/electronic equipment) might be an idea? --MilkMiruku 19:18, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

I agree completely that hip-hop belongs in this list. It's funny that most people don't normally associate hip-hop with electronic music. I suppose they feel that can't be gangster and like what they call techno at the same time. At any rate hip-hop is almost always completely sequenced and synthed, and often times, aside from the vocals, is completely electronic. As to where it belongs, I would say breakbeat. TheDapperDan 20:53, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

Hip-Hop is definitely electronic music. In its early days it may have been more common to loop breaks in vinyl as opposed to create tracks using samplers and drum machines, but the same could be said of house music. Distinguishing between the different subgenres is also vitally important in places - the differences between mainstream and underground hip-hop, and the attitude of the scenes and the people producing it, are enormous. I agree that it would belong in the breakbeat section as a hip-hop track without vocals sounds like a slowed down and more minimalist breakbeat track - Ishkur's guide to electronic music places it in this category anyhow. Zeibura 17:38, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] new approach

i think the ever splitting up of music genres is a dead end street, the desperatly trypngn to determine wehter a genre is part of breakbeat or drumandbass is rediculous because every day new kids rize that don't care about these petty boundaries and trying them to fit the system is an insult to their creativity. electronic music genres and their definitions are organic entities. breaks, jungle, idm, hardcore, my "specialties" all have many overlapping subgenres. and artists that can be qualified as at least7 or8 of these subgenres.. so this list i quite a oversimplification and straight mispresentation of the truth --Droon 12:14, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

who says people should make music for only one genre? music genres are something that you use to describe a sound afterwards, not to control or define it. imo experimental and cross genre pollination is the future of music. breakcore is listed under breakbeat because it's the main influence on the genre. ideally you'd want some sort of 3d model to describe relationships between genres but because wikipedia doesn't do this but has a tradition of hierarchical list of articles, we are here today. i severly doubt anyone who's interested in finding out about breakcore will just look at this page and think "oh, it's kinda like breakbeat" and not look at the article itself which obviously has a much more informative description, or even listen to examples of breakcore from the artists listed on the page. --MilkMiruku 21:28, 4 December 2005 (UTC)

well, this comming from personally knowing most breakcore artists in the world i can pretty surely state not many of them were "influenced" by breakbeat as a genre, which i even doubt exists, a breakbeat is a kind of beat used in a million genres. breakcore, digital hardcore and drill'n bass are generally the same thing,i can describe them seperalty but the boundaries between them are so blurred that it's more like a cloud of hard fast chaotic breakbeat music. same parties same crowds same labels. and people all over will interchange these terms. yet they are in totally different collums.

• i would think grime is a kind of hiphop fused with evolved uk garage/2step
• i would think idm is not at all downtempo since i know several idm records passing 200 bpm, like squarepusher etc..

anyway, these are just the genres i know something about, i'm sure everyone has a different opinion on how this jizz should be run, which is part of the problem. so ok, you have the list and the sublist function in wikipedia and you can't very well make it 3D or make it look like a network of influences which would closer to the truth, but maybe you can do some things to the same effect, like , maybe a list of influences underneath each genre. but then many genres are well defined and nicely classifiable in topgenre-subgenre means, but many other are way more fluid.. ok, i guess for now the list will do, but maybe a little diclaimer that a list can't do justice to the many intricate relations between many of these genres, or even place individual genres correctly.--Droon 12:13, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

I agree completely that IDM isn't downtempo...it just plain isn't. As a matter of fact, it's the exact opposite, it's up-tempo. IDM belongs under jungle/drum and bass. TheDapperDan 21:01, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

yeah, initially idm started of with ambient techno but quickly drew in influences from a variety of genres and became more of a style or production method than a particular sound. that's a hard one to pin down these days. --MilkMiruku 00:52, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

i was just wondering why IDM is listed under house? Zeibura 17:40, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Left-Field House

Hi. I'm very confused where to put this request, but it seems to be OK here: There's an article on Bugge Wesseltoft in which the genre "Left-Field House" is used. I could not find essential information about it, while seeing it being used often elsewhere. It doesn't seem to fit near House music, because it appears to be more related to Jazz and other electronic genres. I can't read Russian, but this seems to be an interesting explanation: DJ.ru Left-field House --Reuben Honigwachs 00:08, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

Bugge Wesseltoft mentions his style is nu jazz/future jazz. "Left-Field House" isn't really a genre; the jazzlandrec.com author is probably using "left field" to mean "weird ass" or something similar ;) --MilkMiruku 00:45, 5 December 2005 (UTC)

leftfield IS a genre, at least, i've seen it mentioned as such on many occasions. it sounds like the producers "leftfield" which, top my understanding, places it kind of a in a triangle with big beat and trip hop. same period aswell. this could co-incide with the new jazz label, as leftfield would be the slightly more experimental then triphop or big beat. --84.195.27.179

i'm not denying that people use the term "leftfield", but i was suggesting that due to the fact that there are no basic references to the general definition of the specific term "leftfield house" that one can find on google (except in russian :o) that it's use in the term "leftfield house" was more as an adjective rather than a definite music genre name that people activly use. --MilkMiruku 17:06, 18 December 2005 (UTC)

Per the earlier discussion on 'leftfield': leftfield, as I understand it, is more of a generic term meaning an unusual form of the genre. So, 'leftfield house' would refer to something house-like but which doesn't exactly fit into the usual confines of that genre. I agree that it's not a proper genre in itself but, rather, a catch-all term for music which contains some unusual element that sets it ouside the larger genre. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 205.202.240.251 (talk • contribs) .

[edit] Changes and reasoning

FYI, I changed the genre "Hardcore techno" by removing the "techno" part. "Hardcore techno" was misleading because it assumed that everything hardcore could also be considered techno. I disagree. EmJAY 23:10, 15 December 2005 (UTC)

I agree completely that "Hardcore techno" is wrong. The title of Hardcore techno should be changed to just Hardcore. TheDapperDan 21:01, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

while i agree with shortning article names for subgenre footers, hardcore techno is rather seperate to breakbeat hardcore. i recently created hardcore dance music which has some info on genres that have been called 'hardcore', but as it is used to refer to genres so far apart it's not really valid as a genre on this list. genre names that refer to more than one sound are kinda problamatic with a 2-teir style list like this. --MilkMiruku 00:52, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Slang is not a suitable form of language for encyclopedias

Please read it carefully: the genres you are talking about are nothing else than sub-genres of modern Disco Music (I mean music for nightclubs or whatever you may define). In other words "Electronic Music" is exactly the "Electronic art music". The same applies to "Ambient music", that people below 30 in USA and Europe regard as a subgenre of Acid, House, Techno or whatever the modern Dance Music has been called. If you are having any doubts, I would suggest you to enquire any University's Music department. skysurfer 23:51, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Splitting and merging issues

I suggest to split the Electronic music article in two parts, the first can merge with Electronic art music and the second with the Electronica article.skysurfer 03:47, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Psychadelic?

I use this page quite frequently to brush up on my genres, but I noticed Psychadelic was split off of Trance. Psychadelic, is not a genre, although it could be a way to describe music. Does anyone else think Psychadelic needs to be merged with Trance? FreeLance FoX 21:01, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

I think, it should be renamed to Psytrance or something like that, but I'm sure Psytrance & (Euro)trance should be handled seperatedlatedly, because Goa-/Psytrance is actually not trance, just the name of it. Maybe it has the trance, because it was hypnotic, like the first ones of trance music pieces, but otherwise there's almost no relation beetwen them. Today's "normal" trance music turned into an emotional music, while goa/psy is much darker, uses a lot more acid, and also it's psychedelic. Actually, EBM is more closer to Psytrance, than regular trance, and this is where it's roots came from, not "classic" trance or progressive trance. But I think neither Industrial nor Trance is the same category as Goa/Psy/Isratrance. Goatrance has it's own subculture, and they're not clubbers or goths, but actually "modern hippies". Psytrance also has about as much subgenres, as normal industrial, or trance, or techno, and all of them is recognizeable enough to not mistake it with an other genre. --TaZaR 11:47, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Fixed'd

I just did an overhaul of the main genres page. I pretty much removed all the stubs that had no feasible existance. Most of them were either types of music with a country infront or different types of psytrance, which should fall under psytrance itself. FreeLance FoX 04:02, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

So, now Synthpop is a "subgenre" of Electronic art music? That's ridicolous, this whole list is ridicolous. --''skysurfer'' 06:36, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

I had nothing to do with that.; Electronic Art music was made maybe a week ago by someone who seemed to know what they were talking about. However, you're right about synthpop. I'll fix that. FreeLance FoX 14:46, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Uh, "Rave music" in psytrance genre? Why? Also, those psygenres shouldn't be removed in my opinion, unless Infected Mushroom & Xenophobe are in the same subgenre, but they're very far from each other. If the problem was those styles haven't got correct definition I'll try to dig up sources, and wrote one for them. I also noticed Nitzhonot is removed, which is really much a noticable sub-style, since it's the combination of anthem-trance & goa. It's played by artists like Eyal Barkan (who's the most noticeable), X-Men, Goldenfinger, and there are tracks by even Astral Projection & Yahel in that style. The Melodic Morning compilations in that style too. There's killerspy/horrortrance too, (I don't know how it's called) played by artist like Xenophobe, Para Halu, etc. As I said, I'll try to make articles for these subgenres in the future... --TaZaR 22:16, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

I'm not saying those genres don't exist. The reason why some of them were removed was because they didn't have any sources and I couldn't vouch for them. The other thing was someone had added a bunch of genres that were just a genre with a country infront. That doesn't make it a different genre! If it has a specific other name and notable artists or albums, it IS a genre. That's my 2 cents. Also, if I deleted nitzhonot I apologize. I've heard of that one. Peace dude, FreeLance FoX 23:40, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Right, I understand, and your right about it. I'll try to write definition for those styles with correct/credible sources. --TaZaR 21:36, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Metallica & UK Psytrance

Okay a question: What are these genres exactly? UK Psy is like Juno Reactor, or what? If I remember correctly I've been never heared that expression yet. Metallic(a?) is stands for psytrance tracks with electronic guitar used in them I guess. That's a quiet dabateable thing, Ishkur called it Buttrock Goa in his guide, otherwise I haven't really remember mentioning it as a seperated style. The other problem is, a lot of thoose tracks ar already different genres, just some of them has guitar. For example Xenomorph has thoose horrorpsy/killerpsy tracks, and some of them has guitars. Or 1200mics/SUN Project both playing "standard" (traditional, basic, classic, whatever), and has some guitared tracks too. Or Skazi, his style is different too. (by the way how it's called? hard psytrance? there are a lot of artist from that style -GMS, Technodrome, etc- and all of them called just psytrance, however it's not classic psy, and neither fits to the current or past genres, like dark, suomisaundi, SA, psytechno, full on, etc.) So basically psy + electronic guitar is not a genre itself, just there are tracks from different styles with guitars. But correct me, if I'm wrong. Or that metallic psy goes for Skazi's style? Hope someone knows the answer, I'm really into this topic. --TaZaR 12:07, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dance

I've got a question:

if Electronic Dance music is Electronic music, why is it not posted on the list with its own subgenres? This doubt comes to me since I was trying to classify Paul Van Dyk, just let me know if it'd be correct:

Genre: Electronic.

Subgenre: Electronic Dance.

Performer: Paul Van Dyk.

SALUX!!!
EOZyo (мѕğ) 04:03, 17 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] new age: contradiction

Quote from new age music: "Ambient music in fact became an important sub genre of New Age Music." While in the list of electronic music genres, New Age is a sub-genre of Ambient. This is an abvious contradiction, let alone the fact that both views are at least questionable. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Stardancer (talk • contribs) 21:15, 6 January 2007 (UTC). - User:Stardancer

yes you are right. If I try to fix something relevant to popular electronic music genres I get a headache. Will Wikipedia pay the pills for me? It will take at least 1 or 2 years in order to delete and fix the misrepresentation of the real world that ravers (rave subculture members) have put here on this Wiki.Dr. Who 01:15, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Intelligent Dance Music

What shall we call it? House and Ambient are the choices.

House (modern dance music). House was and still is the most suitable term. It has various styles and forms within it, including the so called intelligent, techno or ambience forms.Dr. Who 20:21, 3 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Why is there no full on subgenre in psytrance

There is an article but its not listed here....

[edit] NU-Gaze

I added NU-Gaze to the list, because of the Glitch/Ambient fusion. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 86.89.24.41 (talk) 19:45, 1 March 2007 (UTC).