Talk:Moai
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The page says:
- Moai are monolithic stone statues
but I think that "monolithic" is inaccurate, since many moai have red topknots, carved of a different type of stone, perched atop their heads. Indeed, one of the moai in the photograph on the page is still so adorned.
-- Dominus 22:33, 13 Apr 2004 (UTC)
I have clarified the monolithic nature a little better I think. --Jimaginator 14:06, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
[edit] Bogus Picture
The second picture down on the right, "A close up of the moai at Ahu Tahai", is clearly Homer Simpson.
[edit] Pronounciation
How do you say "Moai?" Thank you.
I believe that it is "MOH-EYE", at least that is how it was pronounced on NOVA --Jimaginator 13:58, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)
Im from Chile and your pronounciation comes very close to the way we say it(easter island is property of the republic of Chile)
i cant really speficy where the accent on the word goes though.
[edit] Discrepancy
The page says that the statues "were carved by the Polynesian inhabitants of the islands 1000 or more years ago." However, the Easter Island page says that the prevaling theory is that they were carved between 1600 and 1730. I don't know enough to know which is correct, but the discrepancy should be cleared up. -- Eric 19:01, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- There is no strong evidence of the Moai being extremely old, though I suppose it's 'possible'. There are some arguments for a greater antiquity than is commonly supposed, but in Wikipedia precedence is given to standard views held by the experts in the field. Alexander 007 03:15, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
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- Pardon my intrusion, but can you please state which Wikipedia policy you, Alexander 007, are referring to.--AI 21:07, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- Read Wikipedia policy: "views should be given weight equal to their standing". You can also find more discussions of this. Like it or not, this system prevents chaos and unlikely fringe theories from taking over articles. Otherwise, any jackass can just add any fringe theory into an article, and present it as the dominant theory. Other views of lesser standing must be treated as such. We all have our own ideas, but only a jackass forces fringe theories into a prominent position in a Wikipedia article.
- If someone wants to add a section discussing the controversy over their antiquity, that is fine. That's not what I reverted. Alexander 007 23:16, 13 Jun 2005 (UTC)
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- I agree with that system and thanks for the clarification. However, can you provide a link to the exact policy?--AI 01:59, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)
- I'm happy to hear that you agree with the policy, because you will see that the policy will often work to your advantage. I will try to find a more complete link. I quoted that text from this article:Wikipedia. Note also, that if someone was not aware of the policy, he/she cannot be considered a jackass, an animal symbolic of stubbornness. Alexander 007 02:03, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)
a study demonstrated that around the moais, there used to be rich vegetation (such as forest), all of it made the movement of these statues a much easier task.
[edit] Moai Stealing
theres information lacking, mainly about the stealing of these statues by other countries (and/or excentric millionaires). As ive heard, only a few moais are still standing on the island (considering the original number of moais), could someone elaborate more into it? Yeah, simply not true. There are a great deal on the island and, although they have not all been counted, there are still a very large amount on the island. Its possible, but not likely.
- For the record, there is a genuine moai on display at the Forest Lawn Mortuary Museum in Glendale, CA. The placard says it's the only one legitimately removed from the island.--Funhistory 02:25, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Moai groups of Okinawa
Do not forget that moai is also the Japanese word for a financial-cooperation and friendship group. http://www.okinawatimes.co.jp/eng/ryukyu/ryu3_6.html
There really needs to be a page about this meaning of moai.
Plus, there is no Einglish word for a club of this sort, so I would not think it correct to say that the word should be listed only in http://ja.wikipedia.org/
Isn't this the same as a "Friendly Society" or "Mutual Society"? These are societies of people from similar backgrounds established to cooperate in financial matters. They range from simple things like burial clubs (the society pays for the burial of its members who all contribute a subscription during their life times) to Cooperative Societies which operate to provide advantageous terms for goods by buying in bulk. These latter have moved a long way from their roots and are now a major player in several UK markets.--APRCooper 14:50, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Walking Moai
"Another, less viable theory is that the moai may have been "walked" by rocking them forward." Why is it "less viable" that they were rocked forward? I remember seeing a documentary where Thor Heyerdahl demonstrated exactly that.
He presented evidence that the edges at the base of the statues were well worn, being more worn the further away they were from their volcanic source. The myth of the Islanders were that the Moai "walked" to their areas. A chief later told him that the secrets of how the Moai were constructed and moved were secretly handed down within particular families. To prove his story, a group of islanders began to carve up a carving at the vocanic area using various chantings to keep rhythm. The carving took a surprisingly short time. It was then lifted up by the head using another chanting rhythm whereby a group pulled on a rope tied to the head of the statue in intervals while others put various sized stones under the immense statues. Again, the speed and efficiency of the islanders were unexpectedly fast and efficient. Once upright four ropes were tied around the head and acted as guy wires to keep it up. Two more ropes were tied around the "torso." The rest was truly incredible. As the two ropes around the torso were alternately pulled forward, the Moai seemed to be walking! And at a pretty good pace too. I would like to add this to the article. Unfortunately, I can't find the video or dvd of it yet. I can't remember if I saw it on A&E, TLC, the Discovery Channel, History Channel, etc. Any suggestions?Edgar Kavanagh 11:39, 4 November 2005 (UTC)Edgar Kavanagh
- I hadn't noticed that an anon had added the descriptor "less viable" to this theory. As you say, it certainly is viable as it has been done. This PBS programme is probably what you saw and there is other documentation for the theory in the references and external links section of this article: [1], [2] DoubleBlue (Talk) 23:55, 4 November 2005 (UTC)
Other researchers and experimentors (Charlie Love comes to mind, though Bill Mulloy hypothesized that they were moved in a wooden travois- without any evidence) have also attempted to use walking as a mode of transport for the statues as legends mention the moais walking to the ahu. As the story goes, a witch who whom others did not share lobster, made the moai "fall down" as they were walking to ahu. If one examines pictures of the moai at the base, the palagamite tough has pressure chips that do look as though massive pressure had pressed these away- leading one to believe that they were indeed moved upright. Though I have great respect for the work of Heyerdahl, I'm not sure he was correct with all his hypotheses. - S. Kimble
[edit] Height and Weight
I think the article should say how high and how heavy these things are. Can someone supply this please? -- Perfecto 06:53, 10 December 2005 (UTC)
El Gigante though never moved weighs in the neighborhood of 300-400 tons. One of the moai at the ahu Tongariki weighs in at over 80 tons. I'm not sure how tall it is though. -S. Kimble
[edit] Knocked over
By the mid-1800s, all the moai outside of Rano Raraku and many within the quarry itself had been knocked over. Were they knocked over by the inhabitants, by others or did it have a natural cause? Tbc2 20:40, 12 December 2005 (UTC)
According to Jared Diamond in the video 'Jared Diamond - How Societies Fail-And Sometimes Succeed - Long Now Foundation' http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4271982381147720351, the statues were knocked over during civil wars on the island between tribes after environmental collapse and extreme resource pressure took place.--Kaze0010 08:54, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] HOW TO MAKE WALKING MOAI
Legend said Moai walked by itself. But how did Moai walk? I show you my proposal. http://www.tegakinet.jp/moai.htm You can watch some videos of Walking Moai on this site.
I watched a special feature TV program of Easter Island in January, 2004. In this program, form of a base part of a moai was not flat, and Professor archeologist Charles love of Wyoming university explained that it was easy to incline forward when a moai stands on the ground. As for this, there is a description in a homepage of Kontiki Museum. http://www.museumsnett.no/kon-tiki/Research/Papers/walking_statue.html
Some methods about a movement of a moai are suggested. Particularly a method of Mulloi http://www.museumsnett.no/kon-tiki/Research/Papers/walking/figs/fig1.html
and a method of Pavel are famous. http://www.museumsnett.no/kon- tiki/Research/Papers/walking/figs/fig4.html
However, nothing can explain that moais are easy to incline forward. I thought that the base of the moai in TV looked like a rocking chair, because it curved gently. I thought that moais swung in front and back.
When I was child I had a walking toy that walked on the desk which was inclined. I thought that moais walked on same principle.
A web site of Michigan university introduces "Passive Walk". This is known as a phenomenon of a limit cycle. http://www-personal.engin.umich.edu/~artkuo/Passive_Walk/passive_walking.html
I referred to them and repeated an experiment and succeeded in letting a ornament moai to walk. My father got this moai as a souvenir from his friend who went to Chile of South America for a trip more than 20 years ago.
How do you think about it? Does the moai which I thought about seem to walk? Would the genuine moai walk in this way? Please send your opinion.
We can never know exactly how they walked, but it is almost assuredly the case that they did. I studied under Charlie Love (who is at Western Wyoming College, not the University of Wyoming where he went to school and studied under Bill Mulloy) and I saw the very video you are talking about and I've heard Pavel Pavel's method. Charlie also has a degree in geology and the studies he's done on the moai roads and the moai bases show stress fractures at the base that are consistant with force exerted up from the base. That would lead one to believe that it would have to be upright during transport. You want more info to support this? If one follows the moai roads from Rano Raraku to the various ahu around the island, moai are found broken and face down, up and on their sides along the roads. The fact that they are broken makes complete sense if they were upright. In addition to that, it would also make sense that they would have fallen on their sides, faces and backs. This evidence leads me to believe that Pavel Pavel or Charlie have already found and described the method. S. Kimble
[edit] Moai with Wooden Tablets ?
I heard that when they were first found, many Moai were carrying wooden signs in some unknown language but these signs were destroyed by the Europeans who thought they were "pagan". Couldn't find any info here ... is it not true?
I think what you are referring to are the rongo rongo boards. These were the only polynesian examples of writing at their time. However, they were not directly associated with the moai in this manner to my knowledge. They were, interestingly enough, written with every other line being upside-down so that to read, one must turn it topside down after the completion of each line. -S. Kimble
Or (a suggestion made to me a couple of weeks ago by Christian Pakarti) that if two people were reading/singing from a rongo rongo, they could sit opposite each other and alternate the lines read/sand ~ Cass
[edit] Miro Manga Erua means 'Two wooden fingers' in Polynesian language
http://www.tegakinet.jp/miro.htm
I got a book titled "AKU-AKU" "THE SECRET OF EASTER ISLAND " by THOR HEYERDAHL English edition. This book is very rare, so I had only Japanies edition befor. In this book, Heyerdahl ask Mayor Don Pedoro about moving method of moai.
AKU-AKU THE SECRET OF EASTER ISLAND THOR HEYERDAHL
p132-p133
ʋ ɹ ɻ ɰ ʋ ɹ ɻ ɰ ʋ ɹ ɻ ɰ
"Don Pedoro, Mayor,"I said, "now perhaps you can tell me how your ancestors moved the figures round about on the island." "They went of themselves, they walked," the mayor replied glibly. "Rubbish,"I said disappointed and slightly irritated. "Take it easy! I believe that they walked, and we must respect our forefathers who have said that they walked. But the forefathers who told me that not seen it with their own eyes, so who knows if their forefathers did not use a miro manga erua?" "What that?" The mayor drew on the ground a Y-shaped figure with crosspieces, and explained that it was a sledge made from a forked tree trunk. "At any rate they used those to drag the big blocks for the wall," he added by way of a concession. "And they made thick ropes from the tough bark of the hau-hau tree, as thick as the hawsers you have on board. I can make you a specimen. I can make a miro manga erua too."
ʋ ɹ ɻ ɰ ʋ ɹ ɻ ɰ ʋ ɹ ɻ ɰ
Miro Manga Erua means 'Two wooden fingers' in Polynesian language.
Miro = wood (like rakau) Manga = toes, fingers (in the tropics of Polynesia, it also means star fish) Erua = Two (rua = two, e = how many there is)
I succeed to make a Walking Moai by using Miro Manga Erua. http://www.tegakinet.jp/moai.htm You can watch some videos of Walking Moais. And I had made 'Walking Moai Simulator' and Estimation of strength of Miro Manga Erua for giant Moai.
[edit] image display problem in Firefox (Easter_island_(Chile).jpg)
In Firefox, this image partially overlaps the text. It seems to be an issue with the wiki's Image 'left' or 'thumb' options making imperfect code. Also note the image isn't vertically positioned quite next to the text as the wiki code implies. Looked fine in IE.--Kaze0010 09:04, 21 June 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Pop culture references
I have moved these to a separate article to give them their due. Kahuroa 00:27, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
