Talk:Ohio University
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Someone should make mention of OU's E.W. Scripps School of Journalism, which is within the College of Communication, since it's one of the premier journalism schools in the country. Said someone should not be me, because I really know very little about the school, other than it's very selective and very prestegious.
Why mention one program at a school without mentioning the others? Ohio University is also known for making many modern discoveries in Physics, for having one of the top Aviation Programs, etc.
[edit] First and Finest
I have removed the phrase "is often referred to the first and finest university in Ohio." There are a few reasons. One, I find only scant mention of the phrase being used and in the few examples I saw, it was OU saying so. Second, it's not clear that OU is either the first or finest in the state. Marietta Academy was a degree-granting school founded in 1797 - though not chartered until 1835. Part of this can be blamed on the difficulty in chartering a college where no state government existed (OU and the State of Ohio were founded in 1808 and 1803). As to being the finest, I really am unsure what we are talking about. If this were Harvard's homepage I would have no problem with it saying that Harvard is traditionally recognized as the best university in the United States. I would oppose including empty phrases. Rkevins82 05:45, 6 August 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Presidents table
Is this necessary? I don't see many universities that have it, plus it is a red-link table. Rkevins82 - TALK 04:06, 30 August 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Presidents Table
That was just the first step of what I was planning for the Ohio University page. Right now I'm working on writing articles about each of the former presidents, but it might take me a little while.
I agree that all the red links look bad at the moment though, perhaps it would be best to remove the table until some more of the articles about former presidents are completed.
However, I have noticed that many universities do have a list of their former presidnets. I didn't do an extensive search, but here are a few:
- University of California
- Mercer University
- Stanford University
- University of Washington
- Brown University
- Johns Hopkins University
- Ohio Wesleyan University
Kwiksilver 03:45, 1 September 2005 (UTC)
[edit] Carnegie Foundation
It was named... what?Madmaxmarchhare 02:08, 30 October 2005 (UTC)
- Ohio University was named by the Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching to reflect its growing number of graduate programs. Only four other ins
[edit] First and Finest, Revisited
"Ohio's First and Finest" was a school slogan used by the university in the eighties and nineties. The slogan was branded all over campus. That's probably where you heard it. BTW, Ohio University was the first school to be chartered in the Northwest Territory, but that occurred in 1804, not 1808. Also, the State of Ohio was founded in 1803, not 1808. - johnthacker83
[edit] MAC Template Inclusion
Template in question:
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| East division | Akron • Bowling Green • Buffalo • Kent State • Miami • Ohio |  |
| West division | Ball State • Central Michigan • Eastern Michigan • Northern Illinois • Toledo • Western Michigan | |
| Affiliates | Indiana-Purdue Fort Wayne (men's soccer, tennis) • Missouri State (field hockey) • Temple (football) | |
As it appears on the wikipedia pages of all of the schools in the MAC, I don't see why it shouldn't be included. There is a section of the article on athletics, which the template fits. The school also has to meet requirements for a variety of activities, including the recruiting of all students, because it is a MAC member[1]. Yes, there is an Ohio Bobcats page. The template should certainly be there. I don't, however, see why it shouldn't be in both places. It is maybe five lines long on the average viewer's screen. So why shouldn't it be there? Rkevins82 17:36, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
- It's related only to sports, not the Uni over-all. It should go on that uni's sports article. If it does not apply to the uni over all, then why is it on the "over all" article? It is a question of putting relevant information in the best place. Just because you can repeat yourself on every article doesn't mean it's a good idea to do so. See Wikipedia:Only make links that are relevant to the context "A high density of links can draw attention away from the high-value links that you would like your readers to follow up. Redundant links clutter up the page and make future maintenance harder." But if you really want it there, I don't care that much about this issue. -- Ned Scott 18:26, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
- As I tried to point out in the initial post, being a member of the MAC means that the university must submit to its rules. This applies to ALL students, not just athletes. Rkevins82 18:52, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Is 20+ years long plagiarism scandal recently discovered notable enough to be included in the main article?
While researching plagiarism, I found many news articles like this one and this one stating that there has been a plagiarism scandal that stretches over twenty years in its mechanical engineering graduate program where even masters' theses were plagiarized. Is that notable enough to include on the article on Ohio University? You can find more if you go to Google News and search for "Ohio University plagiarism". Jesse Viviano 03:04, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
- I think it should be included, considering how widespread it was and the media attention it brought.Bcirker 02:52, 24 October 2006 (UTC)
I don't think so. It is not notable piece of information. Most universities have had some sort of scandal which received media attention and they are are not typically included in entries. 26 October 2006
[edit] NPOV?
Now, I may be from Central, and this may come off as a little MAC Championship gamesmanship, but the Athletics section is rife with NPOV liberties. I'm not going to lodge a formal complaint, but come on, this ain't a PR piece here.Bveale 04:15, 30 November 2006 (UTC)
[edit] Sports Cuts
The entire text of a letter to the editor has no place in an encyclopedia. Seriously, can you get any more self-centered?
Your point is well-taken. We are new to Wikipedia and are learning the ropes. The lengthy addition was deleted. Our information on sports cuts at OU belongs here, however. If you go to the link provided for Save OU Sports, you will see that this is entirely legitimate information. Youngsters considering OU, especially if they intend to continue a sports career there, should know this information. We have invested years of effort, our families' resources, and much more in developing our athletic abilities. We also put a great deal of effort into advancing the teams at OU on which we participated. This was taken away from us by OU in a process that violated its policies and NCAA guidelines. We had no advance warning that this might happen. Please visit our website at www.saveousports.org and see why we are so passionate about this issue. Save OU Sports 02:44, 4 April 2007 (UTC)Save OU Sports
[edit] Sports Cuts Entirely Inappropriate
Save OU Sports and the rest of his club continue to act like a whiny group of entitled little kids. You lost your sports...get over it! Move on! That is what people do when far more serious things happen, such as the loss of one's job, the loss of a loved one, etc. The entitlement of today's college students astounds me at times and makes me worry about who will be leading the world in a few years.
That said, the continued placement of this "Save OU Sports" propaganda on this wikipedia page is unjustified. It is a NEWS STORY on campus and you will not find other NEWS STORIES on this page. The page is broad in scope and provides a vague overview of all pertinent areas of Ohio University. We cannot open this page to include NEWS STORIES like it is some sort of daily blog. Otherwise, we would have all sorts of recent stories like the discontinuation of dining dollars at Baker Center from 11-1:00 and whatnot! As a result, the "Save OU Sports" story, like other NEWS STORIES does not, and will not, belong on this page!
If you and your buddies at "Save OU Sports" insist on venting your lost cause on Wikipedia, why not create your own article? That would be a far better alternative to being on the Ohio University page, where it will continue to be deleted by loyal Bobcats.
[edit] Not a News Story - A Major Legal Issue Involving Title IX - A major policy decision by OU that has cost students and families thousands and is forcing many to transfer
We're not trust-funders. This is not propaganda. You talk like someone from OU who doesn't want this issue to get a full airing. Anyone contemplating going to OU has a right to know how this university handles difficult issues that affect the lives of its students - in secret without participation by those such decisions will affect the most.
Our website also draws attention to the financial difficulties OU faces, another material element in any high school student's decision to select a university. Do you want to conceal that information from them, allowing them to commit to OU only to find out after they arrive that programs they may have counted on are going to be cut? This decision cost scores of families paying out-of-state tuition a tremendous amount of money.
If you are worried about who will be leading the world, look to the current crop of university administrators who think nothing about violating their own policies, making representations to students on the swimming and diving team in writing (check our website for the facts) and then surprising them twelve days later with decisions that are completely contrary to the written representations they just made. As role models for the current students, are they setting examples of integrity and transparency that can serve as lessons for the students? If the way they handled this vulnerable group of students is an indicator, then they are very poor role models.
Students who won't take this kind of treatment lying down are the very kind of student you should hope will lead the world in the future.
The kinds of students that devote years developing their athletic expertise are more likely to have the kind of discipline and focus that our future leaders will need. If they were whiny, they would never have undertaken the rigors and demands of an NCAA Division One athletic commitment.
If you are, in fact, a loyal Bobcat (just as are the students who now have to deal with the consequences of the decision made without their knowledge or input), then you might have more concern about the integrity of your university and the direction in which its current management is moving it. OU is a great and storied university and it deserves to be represented and managed far better than it is now.
OU also deserves the attention and action of concerned alumni, as you seem to be, to correct the underlying problems of which this issue is a major symptom.
Kindly see what we have to say on our website before you summarily dismiss us and delete our additions in the future. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Save OU Sports (talk • contribs) 13:42, 6 April 2007 (UTC).
[edit] Agree completely..."Save OU Sports" does NOT belong
While perusing Wikipedia at work today I saw that a "Save OU Sports" article appeared on my alma mater's page. I quickly opted to delete it (as I see has been done by others before me) because, like the guy above states, it is a news story. This site doesn't contain anything else of the like, and it sticks out "like a sore thumb". Agree or not with these sports cuts, you cannot argue against that a daily story (as would be seen in a newspaper for a day or two and then be mentioned sparingly thereafter) just doesn't belong here!
On another note, I saw that you put this stuff (which is almost like an advertisement for your site...that surely does not belong on Wikipedia) on other pages. You put it on the MAC page, where someone else took care of it and called it inappropriate. However, you proceeded to put it on the STATE OF OHIO and OHIO BOARD OF REGENTS pages, where they also were deleted. It can be debated whether or not this belongs on an OU page, but the page of the STATE?? ARE YOU KIDDING ME?? What's next...the United States page?? Please refrain from such selfish and foolish actions and understand the relatively small scope of your incident in comparison to issues of the state and the world. I hate to break it to you, but outside of your club very few people really pay much attention or care about your plight. Sport cuts are a well-known reality in college sports today...they have been done before OU, and will be done after OU.
And before you tell me, like my fellow Bobcat above, to "visit your website", please know that I already have and it does contain some decent information. It is your right to keep that site, whether or not others agree with your "rabble-rouser" stance. However, please don't make Wikipedia pages a "branch" of saveousports.com.
[edit] All Facts need to be represented!
I agree that the Ohio University sports cuts should be represented here on Wikipedia. The situation happening at Ohio University is a disgusting fact. If this is supposed to be an encyclopedia, disgusting or not, all facts should be represented.
[edit] Information Page on Ohio University? More like a Bobcat Booster Page
I guess we'll just have to put up with the deletions and keep replacing our contributions. Above comments from "Loyal Bobcats" indicate that this is a page that is broad and "vague" (not sure what that means) but if you try to learn much about OU, you will find that most of the detailed info is about Bobcat sports. We're not dealing with loyal alumni as much as we are with the Green and White club whose members seem to care far more about football and basketball than they do about what has been done to time-honored OU sports traditions - Olympic sports cut summarily, an OU Hall of Famer (NCAA Hall of Famer Stan Huntsman) demanding that OU remove his plaque from its own hall of fame, NCAA Champ Elmore Banton publicly denouncing OU's sports cuts.
Wake up people! This is our university too and we have a right to fight back. Your deletions don't speak as much about your loyalty to OU as they do about the fact that you simply want to keep us quiet and go on pretending that OU traditions aren't being trashed in the name of the almighty dollar.
When other OU cuts come down the road, as appears to be happening with its current budget crisis, are you going to be nearly as indignant if a group puts up a notice that a particular degree program was cut? I don't think so. To a great many of the athletes whose programs were cut, loss of those sports is a setback to their professional careers. The experience they hoped to gain from competing at college was experience they intended to put to good use as they pursue a professional career in sports - coaching, administration and the like. As we have said before, that experience, to them, is just as important as their courses.
Enjoy your tailgate parties "Loyal Bobcats." OU football goes on at the expense of those kids who directed you to your parking places during football games (all members of the "lesser sports programs,") who sold you those raffle tickets in the parking lots, who staffed the admission gates, and who did thousands of hours of unpaid, volunteeer work at games also as loyal Bobcats. Kids on the other teams put their volunteer hours directly into the football and basketball budgets and in return they were stabbed in the back. Those are the same kids whose sports cuts were planned and executed behind their backs. Shame on OU and shame on you for trying to muzzle them.
If OU is such a great university, then it can stand a little controversy and come out of it the better for it being aired. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Save OU Sports (talk • contribs) 09:31, 7 April 2007 (UTC).
[edit] Proposed addition to Ohio University website
In accordance with guidance we received recently from Wikpedia administrators, we are posting below a proposed insertion into the Ohio University Wikpedia page. This insertion is almost identical in structure and type of content to an edit on at least one other university's Wikpedia website in that it deals with Title IX, a law that precipitated an important action by Ohio University. We checked with Wikipedia and are given to believe that the other posting we found was consistent with their guidelines and remains on that university's website as a result. Since this proposed edit tracks with the one allowed to remain on Wikipedia, we believe this conforms to Wikpedia's guidelines. This proposal is open for editing and comment before posting. Following a period of time allowing for others to comment, it will be added in its edited form provided it is not materially revised.
To those who object to this issue appearing on OU's Wikipedia page, it is not a news report or simply a passing situation. It provides information that is relevant to a large group of current and alumni Bobcats and deals with a decision that has fundamentally altered OU's athletic environment and has become a major event in OU history. When Olympic sports with almost 100 and 72 years respectively of history at OU are dropped, it is a major event and not a fleeting news story. The contributors of this are Bobcats too and expect to be allowed to post this information without undue interference.
Proposed addition:
"Title IX compliance On January 24, 2007, Ohio University Athletic Director Kirby Hocutt announced that four sports teams would be eliminated effective the end of the 2006-2007 academic year. The affected teams were Women’s Lacrosse – one of the fastest growing sports in the U.S., Europe, Australia, and New Zealand, Men’s Swimming and Diving – 72 years of tradition at OU, and Men’s Indoor and Outdoor Track and Field – almost 100 years of tradition at OU and counting for two teams for Title IX purposes. The stated reason for the cuts was to comply with Title IX requirements, specifically that the ratio of male-to-female student athletes match the whole student population. The Athletic Director also explained that Ohio University’s athletic budget was under strain and that the school could no longer insure that student athletes participated in a “quality sports” program.
Many students were angered by the cuts, complaining that only less-popular and “non revenue” sports were affected, and not sports such as football. The Athletic Director stated that resources budgeted for the cut sports would now be “strategically reinvested” in revenue sports. Numerous editorials have appeared in newspapers across the country, both in support of and against the decision. “The Post Online,” “The Athens News” and “The Athens Messenger,” newspapers serving Ohio University’s region, all carried detailed reports on this decision. Ohio state-wide newspapers such as the “Cleveland Plain Dealer” and the “Columbus Dispatch” have also carried articles about this decision as well as reports about compliance with Title IX by Ohio schools in general.
In direct response to Ohio University student athletes’ expressions of concern about this decision, NCAA President Myles Brand, in his weekly podcast on March 5, 2007, discussed the continuing trend of U.S. universities using Title IX as justification for cutting sports programs for budgetary purposes. The Chairman of the College Sports Council, the American Lacrosse Conference, and the Executive Director of the College Swimming Coaches of America all issued statements or gave interviews expressing disappointment over this decision by Ohio University."
--Save OU Sports 14:42, 7 April 2007 (UTC)Save OU Sports
[edit] It Just DOESN'T fit
I don't care how you jazz it up...a reasonable argument cannot be made to put this on the OU page. Other controversies at OU are not mentioned here...why should this one?? There is no mention of the plagerism scandal, budget cuts, IT hacking, etc. This is a smaller "scoop" than those are, and coming from someone who stated that athletics take up too much of a proportion of the OU page, why are you picking an athletics issue to take up a large proportion of the page?
Also, to call this "a major event" in OU history is laughable. Mabye a fairly large event of the year, but its nothing to a school with a 200 year history. OU has been around long before these cuts and will exist long after...and unlike what you say, it is a "passing situation". Twenty years from now when these sports are long gone, few will remember that they ever existed. Heck, most people around Athens have already forgot about the cuts...the story was in the paper for two days and left. People move on...so should "Save OU Sports" and their agenda.
[edit] Disagree
Why aren't other controversies mentioned on this site? Those are major financial, ethical, and management issues that people associated with OU and those contemplating association should know about. Shouldn't prospective students and their families know about such things before they make a major academic career and financial commitment to a school? Budget cuts are certainly material to them. Withholding this information from them through the pressure of a group who simply don't want OU's athletic program to look bad is wrong. Kids and their families considering schools come to Wikipedia, among other places, to get that information. They shouldn't be subjected to a sanitized presentation. We get the strong feeling that those who seem to care so much about this just don't want the facts to appear.
Once we are finished dealing with this issue, it may be a good idea to author contributions on those issues. We'll let Wikipedia decide if we are compliant.
The issue is still in the papers and it is now in the legal agenda of the US Department of Education's Office for Civil Rights as an official complaint that they are obliged to consider and possibly investigate at OU. Check out the Internet if you don't believe us. Check out the Student Newspaper's recent editorials about Title IX and what it has done and is doing to OU. This proposed addition is about Title IX, a major national legal issue in which OU is now involved.
When a significant activity of a university that has been around for almost 100 years and has produced NCAA titles is dropped - Men's Track and Field, an Olympic sport - how does that not qualify as a major event? As many students who suit up for each Bobcat football game were summarily dropped in this action. If this had happened to the football team, we're sure most of the objections to our proposed addition would evaporate. Why shouldn't actions that affected the lives of these dedicated youngsters count for as much as those on the football team?
We are engaging Wikipedia's experienced volunteers to review this material to tell us if it meets their standards. If it does, we will post it.
This is your chance to contribute edits and you are invited to do so keeping in mind OU's long-term reputation that it has built since 1804, and not short term interests of athletics promoters and boosters many of whose interests in OU are far more financial than anything else. As we said before, if OU is such a strong institution, it can stand a little controversy and its supporters should welcome the opportunity to see that everyone who attends(ed) has a chance to have their say.
--Save OU Sports 18:35, 7 April 2007 (UTC)Save OU Sports
