Talk:Plug-in hybrid electric vehicle/PIA Rewrite

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Plug In America, CalCars, and friends will be attempting a major overhaul of this article here on this sub-talk page, discussion to take place Talk:Plug-in hybrid electric vehicle#PIA Rewrite.

[edit] Intro & Definition - Draft

DRAFT - DEFINITION - PHEV for Wikipedia article on "Plug-in hybrid vehicle"

This section is intended to replace the present introductory language in the article.

Draft date: March 29, 2007

A plug-in hybrid electrical vehicle (PHEV) is any vehicle powered by a combination of internal combustion engine and electric motor whose storage batteries or capacitors can be recharged by connecting the vehicle by plug to an external electrical power source. Plug-in hybrids typically have characteristics of both conventional hybrid electric vehicles (HEV) and of battery electric vehicles (BEV).

A plug-in hybrid may be capable of charge-depleting mode: driving for an extended range in all-electric mode, either only at low speeds or at all speeds, with the internal combustion engine used secondarily for power-assist, and for longer range travel. Alternatively, it may operate in blended mode, in which case the electric motive power displaces some but not all of the vehicle’s fuel consumption during the first part of its driving cycle. Although there is no technically mandated minimum all-electric range (AER), future state and/or federal legislation may address this for policy purposes.

While the term "PHEV" most commonly refers to passenger vehicles, plug-in hybrid technology has been implemented or proposed in delivery vans, trucks, buses, military vehicles, and other medium to heavy-duty vehicles for on- or off-road use. Plug-in hybrid passenger vehicles are presently not in mass production, although some manufacturers have indicated that they are developing PHEVs Prototypes have been built to demonstrate the technology and to encourage its widespread adaptation. Conversions of production model hybrids may be possible through conversion kits or conversion services pending commercial production.

Some PHEVs are adaptations of Toyota Prius hybrid cars. These prototypes retain the Prius's "idle-off" capability and regenerative braking, while adding extended electric-only drive capability, and electrical grid-charging. They have demonstrated fuel economy exceeding 100 miles per gallon of gasoline (plus electricity) in day-to-day driving with electric recharging each night.

Plug-in hybrids have been identified as having significant potential as alternative fuel vehicles. If their battery packs are charged from renewable energy such as solar, wind and/or hydropower, and if their engines can use fuels such as biodiesel or ethanol, then they can operate on minimal ^[1] fossil fuel.

[edit] Section Notes

Notes from Greg:

1. It is assumed that the text will be footnoted and will have various internal and external links as is typical in a Wikipedia article. Once the draft language is commented on and finalized, I would like to add such details with your help.
2. The bar graph at the top of the current Wikipedia article will be removed. In its place will be a better graphic or none at all. Please comment on this. Do we need a new graphic or not? If you think we need one, please suggest the graphic you recommend.

Notes from D0li0 01:39, 7 April 2007 (UTC):

• I would like to retain PHEVs are commonly called "grid-connected hybrids" or "gas-optional hybrids" (GO-HEVs) from the current intro paragraphs.

Re: "commonly called "grid-connected hybrids" or "gas-optional hybrids" (GO-HEVs)": please provide documentation. I have many, many PHEV articles and papers archived. The term "gas-optional hybrid" (GO-HEV) is waning in usage, probably because of its misleading nature: even with E95 ethanol, there is still some gas in the tank. "Grid-connected" hybrids is STARTING to get a little more common, but it's not yet there. A quick Google search confirms my observations: Plug-in hybrid 754,000, PHEV 242,000, GO-HEV 1,410, gas-optional hybrid 1,410, grid-connected hybrid 1,180. --Jack Rosebro 16:49, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

Fair enough, I am not personally attached to gas-optional, rather perhaps combustion-optional... I sorta like grid-connected or gridable as it implies plugging into the grid. Just didn't want to toss our other nicknames that people have been using, such folks can always add them back into the article if they so choose. --D0li0 22:26, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

• Two other names used by a major U.S. automotive supplier and in a 1999 SAE paper are "energy hybrids" and "true hybrids". from the current intro paragraphs. I would like to find a link to the mentioned 1999 SAE paper.

As for the 1999 SAE technical paper, what's the title and the significance, please? There have been many PHEV technical papers in the eight years since. --Jack Rosebro 16:49, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure what the title nor significance is, I just happen to agree very much with the two terms "energy hybrids" and "true hybrids". Energy Hybrid is quite simply one of the most clear and concise way to describe these PHEVs, I take energy to mean energy source or Fuel, Plug-in Fuel specifically. True Hybrids seems ironic as it takes on the tone of mild-, full-, partial-, hybrid and many of the other truly meaningless descriptors since none yet are True energy hybrids. --D0li0 22:26, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

While I can sympathize with your preference for "energy hybrids" or "true hybrids", they aren't in common usage, and aren't technically based. Other cultural terms like strong hybrid, mild hbrid, etc. have the same problem. And as this is a defining section, we have to stick to comman usage. --Jack Rosebro 22:50, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

That sounds reasonable, perhaps they can be used elsewhere in the article but not in this intro paragraph and definitions section. --D0li0 07:38, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

• I would like to retain a link to battery electric vehicles in the intro paragraphs as PHEVs are a combination of HEV and BEV.

• I would like to combine a few of the existing paragraphs into fewer larger paragraphs.

Add BEV and HEV makes sense so the links will be there. And I'm sure the section will be condensed into less (but bigger) paragraphs; here, it's just a data dump. I think I'll adjust that now, come to think of it. --Jack Rosebro 22:50, 8 April 2007 (UTC)

I've updated the links to be less ambiguous. --D0li0 07:38, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

[edit] References

1. ^ Even “pure” biodiesel and ethanol typically contain some fossil fuel-based additives, hence the reference to “minimal” fossil fuel rather than “no fossil fuel.”