Talk:Rio de Janeiro

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Maracanã is still the biggest football (soccer) stadium in the world. However, the biggest stadium of all is in Prague (Czech Republic) but it is not suitable for footbal (soccer). --Pinnecco 00:03, 9 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I would like to have more info about Rio de Janeiro History. --User:Coutinho rafael 14:03, 19 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Thanks very much. Feel free to make the change; we encourage people to be bold in their editing. It's how wikis work. Yours, Meelar 00:04, 9 Apr 2004 (UTC)

As a 'carioca' (person who is born in rio de janeiro), i think the person who made this page forgot to talk about an area called Baixada Fluminense, where, despite of the bad reputation of a dangerous place, has great places for visiting such as Tingua and Seropedica. There are natural reservations and beautiful sight seeing. --Cyberactivist 21:22, 8 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I think this shouldn't be discussed here because the article is about the city of Rio de Janeiro. Although Baixada Fluminense has an important role to Rio in a lot of aspects, there should be a separated article about this region, perhaps in an article talking about the state of Rio de Janeiro. --Bruno Dantas 14:21, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Contents 1 Is that Rio de Janeiro? 2 Population of Rio de Janeiro 3 any abbreviation? 4 Expansion 5 Chaos 6 Map 7 You need Jesus in your life 8 Discovery, foundation and Naming 9 Conspiracy mambo-jambo 10 Barra da Tijuca renamed 11 Flag of the city 12 Sports 13 Ivo Pitanguy 14 Violence 15 Cidade Maravilhosa 16 Sister Citys 17 Black and cream pavement? 18 summer temperatures 19 TRANSPORTATION 20 Ancient meaning of Rio in Spanish 21 Simple English 22 Good link for restaurant guide in Rio de Janeiro 23 Requested move to "Rio de Janeiro City" 24 São Sebastião do Rio de Janeiro 25 Crime? 26 Looks perfect 27 Violence doesn't exist in Rio?

[edit] Is that Rio de Janeiro?

Hey guys, I know you are probably ashamed of Rio, however it's not nice to hide all the bad part of the city. Wikipedia is not supposed to be a travel guide, it's an ENCYCLOPEDIA so I suggest you guys should have more pics of the violence, favelas, drug traffic, tourists killed and stoled and etc...

[edit] Population of Rio de Janeiro

"Its population is estimated at 8 million people occupying an area of 485 square miles (1256 km²)."

Portuguese and German 'pedias say that the number of people is about 5.8 million occupying that area. Also, this page [1] gives similar figures for 2000, and 6 150 200 for 2004.

Later on in the article there is a mention: "the city's 13 million inhabitants"... Indeed, it seems according to different web sources that the Rio metropolitan area has about 10-13 million people altogether.

Anyone have more accurate information on this? For now, I'm making some changes based on the above. --Jonik 19:55, 10 Aug 2004 (UTC)

The municipal authority accounts for 6-8 million inhabitants; the large metropolitan area however is home to 10-13 million people

---

Rio de Janeiro city 5.8 million Rio de Janeiro state/province 15 million

The city of Rio de Janeiro this a capital of state but other times Rio de Janeiro city is autonomy state/province of "Guanabara".

Web of state/province governament : http://www.governo.rj.gov.br/

Web of Rio de Janeiero City governamet : http://www.rio.rj.gov.br/

Thanks. Sorry for my poor english.

Im sorry, but the above user is misinformed. The population of 15 million is that of what we call in Brazil the "Metropolitan Region" around Rio (also "Big Rio") which includes other neighbouring counties which span into a single urban zone.

The number of 8 million is correct for the actual city of Rio de Janeiro, as far as the 2001 census goes. Id say that by now the true number would be 15,5-16 and 9, aprox.LtDoc 02:04, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] any abbreviation?

Is there any widely recognised abbreviation for Rio de Janeiro, like NYC for New York City? — Instantnood 11:02, Jan 27 2005 (UTC)

Yes there is. The abreviation for Rio de Janeiro is "RJ". However, most of the time it might denominate the State of Rio de Janeiro, and not the city. For example, when posting a letter:

Sr. João Costa
Estrada da Barra, 681
CEP: 22610
Rio de Janeiro, RJ
Brazil

What if I have to refer to the city with an abbreviation, is there any? — Instantnood 16:45, Jan 27 2005 (UTC)

I never saw anyone using any abreviation for the city of Rio de Janeiro. When you use "RJ", it is to refer to the state of Rio de Janeiro, never to the city itself, as in the example above. There might be some sigles of use, but only for very particular uses ApS Camper 05:09, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Thank you. I've tried with Google and it gives 9500 hits for "Rio de Jan". — Instantnood 09:16, Feb 1 2005 (UTC)

Actually, I think that "Rio" is the abreviation you are looking for. The city hall (prefeitura) of Rio de Janeiro tends to use "Rio" for many of its slogans. Also, if you ask someone "where do you live" and this person says "Rio", it is probably the city. Orthewise, the person would say "Niterói", "Belford Roxo", "Volta Redonda", "Petrópolis", (all cities of the state of RJ) or something like that.

-Where do you live?
-I live in Teresópolis
-Where is it?
-In Rio de Janeiro

There are UN/LOCODEs available for lots of places worldwide. Less suited for quoting in text. More a code than abbrev. Tobias Conradi (Talk) 14:55, 31 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Expansion

Please help improve this article or section by expanding it. Further information might be found on the talk page or at requests for expansion. This article has been tagged since January 2007.

This article has gorgeous photos! As mentioned on the featured article candidate page, it needs sections on history, politics, transportation, economics, education, a map or two, etc. See São Paulo or Los Angeles, California. -- Beland 05:38, 29 Jan 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Chaos

Beautiful.. great. But there's traffic drug wars in Rio.. lost bullets, territories challenges, men walking with AK-47 and AR-15 in the streets. Police torturing innocent civil people. Know names of the Scene: "Fernando Beira-Mar", "Elias Maluco", "Zé Preto da Rocinha" and other crazy guys control the city areas in a parallel power.

I think violence should be discussed carefully. Some people commonly exagerate facts. It's true that all these scenes still happen in Rio de Janeiro, but the city is not on a civil war. Rio is nowadays one of the most violent cities in the world, all of this facts mentioned still happen, but it's not commonly seen, although unfortunately they still happen. So, the violence is a problem to Rio, but let us not make it worse than the true thing. --Bruno Dantas 14:21, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Le Monde newspaper: Rio de Janeiro Gang Wars

Bruno Dantas is right. I'm from Rio (although living abroad now) and I go there every Christmas/New Year's and I was never robbed or attacked. Rio in General is probably a lot better than, say, South Central, LA. Its all about being smart and not getting yourself into trouble. Dressing very casual not wearing jewerly: Wise. Walking around Copacabana with a SONY digital camcorder: NOT wise. --Pinnecco 09:33, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC)

LOL at "Rio in general is probably a lot better than, say, South Central, LA". It amazes me some of the things people say. --Serbitar 02:02, 20 May 2006 (UTC)

---

As a teenager who was born and raised in many different parts of Rio, I have only seen one such incident in which I was in a bus that got held up by some punks with a knife. In any city in the world, if you go to a violent section, you'll find violent people. The comparison to south central L.A. is very accurate. I have relatives who lived in south central, and it was an average American city, with neighbors mowing their lawns and walking their dogs. Anybody can find the good side of south central AND Rio. The problem is that "gringos" don't realize that they are leaving themselves open to opportunity. Here's some helpful hints from a carioca.

- If you're walking around with a watch so full of diamonds it weighs down your arm, you can bet you will get robbed.

- If you're in the beach with trunks on at 12-3 p.m., we know you're a foreigner.

- If you only speak English, do NOT make it known to everybody that you only speak English.

- Do NOT walk around with a map in your hand.

- Do NOT take pictures of every little thing in the city.

- Avoid using the city busses, stick to certified Taxis. They have a company logo on the car somewhere. Avoid "blank" taxis, taxis with no company name on it. Also, check for the driver's taxi license located on the back ot the Driver's seat.

- Avoid eating lots of foods you are not used to. Many people complain that foreign food made them sick. Your body is not ready for the change. Slowly, try different things.

- Do not use fanny packs or big wallets. Less attention leads to less problems.

- And most importantly, get a tan BEFORE you go.

Hopefully, I've helped somebody out there. Have a nice trip!

[edit] Map

Would it be possible to get a map showing Rio's position within Brazil? Meelar (talk) 06:09, Apr 14, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] You need Jesus in your life

I think that this page needs a picture of that famous Jesus statue with the arms outstretched. That's probably this cities most famous icon (from the POV of an American).

You mean the Cristo Redentor. Done. --cesarb 22:12, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC)

That's it, thanks!

[edit] Discovery, foundation and Naming

The version I have heard of the discovery and naming does not quite fit with what is recorded here. It says that Gonçalo Coelho discovered the bay on Jan 1st 1502, not Vespucci and not 1501. It also says that the city was founded by frenchman, Nicolas Durand de Villegaignon in 1555 and that the french were finally defeated by the Portuguese on St Sebastian's day (Jan 20th) - hence São Sebastião do Rio De Janeiro - 1567. Estácio de Sá turns up in the story here, rather than at the foundation, as the leader of the Portuguese forces who was mortally wounded in the battle. I haven't got a definitive citation, though - can anyone confirm or debunk? --Mucky Duck 8 Jun 2005

That is closer to what is generally accepted by the Brazilians. It's debatable whether the bay was discovered in 1502 or 1504. However, it is widely agreed upon that the French founded a colony named Antarctic France in 1555. The French were later driven out by Mem de Sá and on Mar 1, 1565, his nephew Estácio founded the city São Sebastião do Rio de Janeiro. The PT version of this article agrees with this. .msbmsb 20:57, 8 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Links:

• Policia Civil do Rio
• pt:Rio de Janeiro (Rio de Janeiro)
• answers.com with more references
• Lonely Planet

Sorry, but I think you misunderstood the PT article. First, the PT article says that Rio de Janeiro was founded by Estácio de Sá (not Mem de Sá) to drive out the French from the region (this is true, and Estácio de Sá was a relative of Mem de Sá). Also, Lonely Planet articles are in agreement with the official historical records that Gaspar de Lemos discovered Rio, and not Gonçalo Coelho. Just search on google: http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&safe=off&c2coff=1&rls=GGLD%2CGGLD%3A2004-46%2CGGLD%3Aen&q=%22gaspar+de+lemos%22+%2B+%22rio+de+janeiro%22+%2B+%22lonely+planet%22&meta=

That's what I said, Estácio founded the city. .msbmsb 13:33, 1 August 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Conspiracy mambo-jambo

Americo Vespuci, Coelho, French pirates... what's next? The grinch? Sometimes I wonder if some people just cut-and-paste the first NONSENSE they read on the Internet as if it is some kind of credible source (like Vicente Piñón discovering Brazil...) -- Give it a rest.

I'm am from Rio de Janeiro, and as all other natives from Rio de Janeiro, we all know that Rio de Janeiro was discovered by Gaspar de Lemos.

Source: Any single Carioca that knows the history of their own city, plus http://pt.wikipedia.org

[edit] Barra da Tijuca renamed

Barra da Tijuca (or "Barra" for short) is not a zone in Rio. Its a neighbourhood, located in the West Zone, along with Jacarepagua, Recreio dos Bandeirantes, etc.LtDoc 02:09, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Flag of the city

Hello boys, I'm putting up the flag from the city of Rio de Janeiro (which is not known by many people), taken from www.fotw.net. Cheers!! Eadl

[edit] Sports

Please consider directing the link for "jiu jitsu" to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BJJ ,which is the Brazilian form of Jiu jitsu and not the Japanese form from which it was originally derived. I think many would agree that there is a significant difference between the two. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Aiswcdjn2 (talk • contribs).

I agree. Is quite different. --Pinnecco 19:50, 22 December 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Ivo Pitanguy

Ivo Pitanguy isn't carioca, he was born in Belo Horizonte, as it can be verified in Wikipedia itself. I believe he probably has an honorary citzenship from Rio de Janeiro (where he spent most of his life), but his birthplace isn't there. Paulogcarvalho 11:41, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Violence

Can I upload some photos of teenagers boys with AK-47 serving trafficants? In the Complexo do Alemao and Vigário Geral they can be photographed easily! --Negaodomorro 17:19, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

To avoid problems with Braazilian justice, dont forget to blurry the boys faces. --Abu Badali 16:45, 19 March 2006 (UTC)

80 homicides per day? That is just wrong. There were about 10.000 deaths in 2005 is the entire RJ state, which is about 30 homicides per day. There are accurate statistics about violence in [2]. Someone should correct that. (I cant do it now, because i'm at work, and some sites are blocked. damn Websense.) Magrovsky 20:03, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

It sounds like the person who put in 80 homicides per day may have misheard the real figure of 18 per day. Well, that's the figure I have for Greater Rio in 2002 (the latest figures I've seen) and it appears to be accurate.

I've also changed the nonsense that this violence in Rio's favelas is somehow organized crime. These are poor, disorganized street toughs we're dealing with, not a wealthy mafia or drug cartel elite. -- Serbitar 02:30, 20 May 2006

[edit] Cidade Maravilhosa

I think the song may not need its own page. Is there space for it here? -- cmh 03:05, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

"Cidade Maravilhosa" is more than just a song, although I was surprised not to find even a mention of it under "Music." (Tijuca 05:18, 23 March 2006 (UTC))

[edit] Sister Citys

What is meant by sister citys here? I suspect that there are at least two concepts being included; twinning with Barcelona and Atlanta against some form of active partnership with Niteroi etc. but I don't really understand. Can we put in some explanation? Mucky Duck 10:53, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Black and cream pavement?

Cream? It was supposed to be white... It's simply a matter of pollution, not color schemes. --Pedro Aguiar 19:41, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] summer temperatures

http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/results.shtml?tt=TT001730 says the record max temperature is 39, the article currently says

Summer heat can be oppressive, occasionally reaching 40°C (104°F) and higher.

One has to be wrong. Looking at the average summer maximums, heat is not all that oppressive. At least ", occasionally reaching..." should be removed, perhaps the entire sentence replaced with "Summer heat can occasionally be oppressive."  ? Mike Linksvayer 02:47, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] TRANSPORTATION

this page is a mess when it comes to transportation. why on earth is there an entire section of the article dedicated to the airports of the city and no mention whatsoever to the mass transport system? There should be a section dedicated to transportation and that's it! All other major cities of the world have it like this, but not Rio!

• Done! But it still needs improving. 201.36.98.55 23:47, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Ancient meaning of Rio in Spanish

Can someone confirm or elaborate on this bit from the article?

"There is a legend that the mariners named the place thus because they thought the mouth of the bay was actually the mouth of a river, but no experienced sailor would make that mistake. At the time, river was the general word for any large body of water."

See also Talk:Río de la Plata. Thanks. Carcharoth 14:42, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

First of all, its Portuguese, not Spanish. And to answer the question, Rio as far as i know, always meant river and not any large body of water. They could have always used mar (sea), baía (bay) or lago (lake) ect ect.. which would have been more appropriate. I believe they genuieally (excuse my english) mistook it for being a river.

[edit] Simple English

[edit] Good link for restaurant guide in Rio de Janeiro

This is a good Restaurant Guide for all the areas of Rio de Janeiro. Always improving with pictures and menus in 6 different languages. [ w w w . t h e r i o c o n n e c t i o n . c o m ]

Seems like a simple commercial site, sorry. BTW, what do policies say about comercial links in talk pages? --Abu Badali 18:47, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Requested move to "Rio de Janeiro City"

Anyone interested please check Talk:Rio de Janeiro (state). Raphael.lorenzeto 13:46, 14 December 2006 (UTC) Hi

[edit] São Sebastião do Rio de Janeiro

The official name of the city isn't São Sebastião do Rio de Janeiro? What about check the examples of the article about Asuncion (Nuestra Señora Santa María de la Asunción) and Caracas (Santiago de Léon de Caracas)? --Filipux 15:21, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Crime?

Any mentions of crime in this article, this is a vergonha, o carioca quer esconder a violência e exaltar as belezas naturais, a sociedade brasileira está chocada atualmente com a morte do garoto João Paulo e a cidade do Rio é considerada uma das mais violentas do mundo. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.79.58.127 (talk) 02:02, 18 February 2007 (UTC).

Agreed. It's João Helio btw. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.58.227.204 (talk) 02:08, 22 February 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Looks perfect

For who lives in Leblon apartments or Tijuca mansions, Rio is perfect until a guy point a gun to your head and you *finally* noted thats something wrong. Common guys, let's back with crime section. There is no secret aboout this, every we brazilions known —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.79.20.194 (talk) 01:13, 22 February 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Violence doesn't exist in Rio?

I am a British-Brazilian who lived in Rio during my childhood, and have some relatives there. By reading the article, it looks like violence is not an issue in Rio de Janeiro (or Brazil as a whole). Yes, there are some areas you should avoid, and you also should not demonstrate wealth, but how about crimes that only exist in Brazil? Quicknappings (Sequestro Relampago) - which is a quick kidnapping where the victim is held for a couple of hours and taken to ATMs to withdraw money - for instance? It is true that a lot of people exaggerate about the violence in Rio, but it is also not as peaceful as Europe or Canada. This article seems to go too much for the good side and oversee the bad side (which, by the way, is typical of Brazilians: the majority of them give too much importance to the good facts and oversee the bad ones).

As somebody said above, this is an encyclopedia, not a travel guide. There should be given more weight to violence in Rio in this article, which is, unfortunately, a true fact of the city (and the country). Almost all Brazilian know horror stories which happened to them or somebody very close to them, related to the urban violence.

Also should be noted that, due to the violence, there's a great increase on gated communities in Rio, and living with bullet-proof cars and high eletrical fences is normal there.

201.82.18.59 23:11, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

---

Organized Crime----------------------

Quote: I've also changed the nonsense that this violence in Rio's favelas is somehow organized crime. These are poor, disorganized street toughs we're dealing with, not a wealthy mafia or drug cartel elite. -- Serbitar 02:30, 20 May 2006 This is simply not true. I lived in Rocinha during 2001. First off all, there was hardly any street crime because the CV-soldados were highly organized, well trained (maybe not as well as you) and paid much better than any police officer. At that time, the CV was glorified by the Rocinha citizens for building schools, streets, recreational places, and preventing break-ins within the neighbourhood (nobody even needed to lock the house). On some bailes the CV gave away cocaine for free to their(!) citizens. They were able to efford all this because of their role in international drug trafficing, controling a considerable flow of cocaine from south america to europe and the united states. I'm aware some things have changed since 2001, but what you say sounds like what your trainer from BOPE told you to give you some self confidence;-)

Sad because this article is spoted by people that live in Leblon. Great. Have you up in the favela in your life? Probably not and will never because carioca's society likes hidde this. João Hélio was killed and everyone was ready to Sapucai jump carnival. Argh I hate you brazilian middle class hipocrites! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.79.48.158 (talk) 01:40, 23 March 2007 (UTC).

As a Brazilian citizen, I also strongly dispute this article's neutrality. The article conveniently ignores that crime is out of control in Rio de Janeiro. Organized crime has effectively created a state within a state, and today criminals act without restraint outside their "traditional" boundaries (slums and shanty towns). I believe the often popular argument that "every large city is violent" doesn't justify omitting this information. --Flavio Ribeiro 04:21, 27 March 2007 (UTC)