Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Automobiles/Proposed naming convention

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This convention is largely the way I have named the few model pages I've started so far and the way in which I think most people seem to name es. However, it should be useful to have this to refer to when people aren't sure exactly what to do. I can't think of any improvements that need to be made, it all seems comprehensive and clearly written as it is. Good work. 999 08:50, 25 May 2004 (UTC)

Contents 1 Disambiguating by year series 2 Name of the main article 3 GM 4 Restarting this 5 Military vehicles

[edit] Disambiguating by year series

When disambiguating by year series, is it possible to separate years by en-dashes, rather than by hyphens? —Vespristiano 02:21, 2004 May 26 (UTC)

I'd rather not do it in page titles; I'm not sure that en-dashes are even supported characters in them (anyone?) and I suspect that they'd be less obvious for users. However, I would support the use of them in the article text. —Morven 05:30, 26 May 2004 (UTC)

I checked, and en-dashes are not supported in page titles. —Morven 08:56, 26 May 2004 (UTC)

[edit] Name of the main article

A discussion over at talk:Mazda Mazda6 leads me to propose another convention - Name articles for the most important and unambiguous version of the automobile or series. By "important", I mean use the least ambiguous, most constant name. Then create redirects from all other name variations.

For example, most world-car articles should be named for their home-market version, and multi-marque models for their most stable/best-selling/most important marque and model name.

• For example, the early Mazda Familia had many names all over the world (Mazda 1000, Mazda 818, Mazda GLC, Mazda 323, etc), but the main article is Familia. I have created redirects to the Familia article from all these other names. In this case, "Familia" is the most stable name, as well as the home-market one.
• Another example is the Dodge Caravan. It has been sold as the Chrysler Caravan, Plymouth Voyager, Chrysler Voyager, and Chrysler Town and Country. But the Dodge is the main version - that name lasted the longest and sells the best.

I'm also putting bold versions of the other names into the article body. So, for example, the Ford Five Hundred article notes that there is a twin, the Mercury Montego.

Comments?--SFoskett 01:08, Aug 23, 2004 (UTC)

Hi SFoskett: I support this totally. I also support the way you've noted the twins down, using bolds—it's what I have been doing, too (great minds think alike).

Using home-market names gets around some other problems. The one I raised on the Mazda 6 talk page was the Chrysler Alpine. The only reason that probably got in there as the lead name was that a Briton wrote it, but Europeans would argue that the Simca 1307 was more widespread and more important (as well as being the last Simca). But it was designed by a Brit in the UK. So the car that got there first would solve this conundrum.

I agree with you on the Dodge Caravan scenario: no other name has been as consistent and many export Chrysler Voyagers (while Plymouth was still around) were rebadged Dodge Caravans with the cross grille.

Finally, I notice the guys at Autoindex[1] tend to go with the original names for the sake of their global database.

Your suggestion sounds like a very workable one. Stombs 00:15, Aug 24, 2004 (UTC)

One of the nice things about the AutoIndex is that they list a vehicles name for major markets. Perhapse we should create a template for vehicle articles with a place in the sidebar for global market names. -- stewacide 03:01, Aug 24, 2004 (UTC)

I would agree in the general case, with the proviso that if there is enough to say under the other name, then having two articles, properly cross-linked, does not hurt. I'm thinking particularly of cases where the cosmetic differences are quite significant and we have pictures of both, or when there is important history separate for both, or indeed the same name was used for several different vehicles over time.

For example, I'd generally want to have articles on any Mercury automobile we might have a photo of, simply because the trim is often so different.

One should always bold every significant name variant, especially if someone might have followed a redirect for that name.

In many cases, this would call for a short stub rather than a redirect, IMO. That short stub would be along the lines of

The Simca 1307, sold in Europe between 19xx and 19xx, was a rebadged Chrysler Alpine; for more details, see that article.

I think this generally works much better than simply redirecting. The redirect might leave someone confused as to why they'd arrived at a page about something quite different. A short stub can quickly explain the differences from the parent vehicle and then send the reader elsewhere for the detailed matter. —Morven 05:33, Aug 24, 2004 (UTC)

I like that, Morven. A stub would be necessary in the cases you suggest. Also I agree that Mercurys deserve their own entries—particularly, too, since the "bloodline" does not always parallel Ford (e.g. the Mercury Cougar)—another case that you've covered. The same argument could be made for numerous GM and Chrysler products. Stombs 14:35, Aug 24, 2004 (UTC)

Generally, though, between those of us on this page, we tend to do a good job—it's just those situations where there are global issues. The Simca is one; just thought of the Holden Astra as another (it wasn't always an Opel clone; it was once a Nissan Pulsar clone). In such cases, the short stub works perfectly. Stombs 15:31, Aug 24, 2004 (UTC)

[edit] GM

I noticed there are entries for General Motors Astra and General Motors Vectra. GM is not a marque unless you count the EV-1. I know by having GM entries, we overcome arguments between Opel, Vauxhall, Chevrolet and Holden. But since these cars are developed by Opel and usually have a pan-European launch where all cars are badged Opels, then can the entries not be for Opel? Stombs 00:09, Aug 27, 2004 (UTC)

Agree, that makes no sense. However this gets kinda' trickey whe you remember the Astra was a Vauxhall model before it was an Opel... It'd be nice if Wikipedia let one article have multiple names, not just redirects. -- stewacide

You're totally right, Stewacide: I forgot about the 1980 Vauxhall Astra. Maybe the Vauxhall Astra page could have an entry for the Mk I, then a link to the Opel Kadett E/Vauxhall Astra Mk II on the Opel page? We do run into a similar problem with the Holden Astra, which was originally a Nissan Pulsar clone before it became the Opel Astra A/Vauxhall Astra Mk III, so there we could put in a brief entry for the days when it was a Pulsar, and then reference Opel afterwards. (It does get confusing, especially now the Australians are saying they'll have 'Astra Classic' and 'Astra' lines after the model changeover. And the Brazilian Chevrolet Astra, too, which got facelifted last year rather than becoming an all-new model as it did in Europe.) I reckon we change the GM pages back to make and model, based on Opel, and make these additional pages for the anomalies in each marque. Stombs 00:25, Aug 28, 2004 (UTC)

Not necessarily that complicated. We simply use a redirect (with a category!) where there are no substantial changes between marques (as in Plymouth Neon and Dodge Neon) and use the most "popular" model as the main page. In other cases (like the Nissan 200SX), we use a disambig page if the same name was used on different models. In still other cases (Think Vauxhall Cavalier), we build whole pages for the model and simply point to the other content as needed. It'll all work out.

BTW, here are the offending pages:

• General Motors Agila
• General Motors Astra
• General Motors Corsa
• General Motors Omega
• General Motors Vectra
• General Motors Zafira

--SFoskett 19:04, Oct 4, 2004 (UTC)

This works for me, SFoskett. If I understand correctly, we make the above Opel pages, but we have unique ones for the Vauxhall Astra, Cavalier and Carlton (where the model series do not parallel Opel) and the Holden Astra (which was a Nissan Pulsar once), where we point back to the Opel one? Stombs 11:18, Oct 26, 2004 (UTC)

I recently took care of the Corsa and Zafira (making Opel Corsa/Opel Zafira the main articles) so I believe all six are proper now. I also recently moved General Motors van to Chevrolet Van, with the former and others (GMC Vandura, Chevrolet Express) redirecting to the latter. --Vossanova ^o< 15:05, 22 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Restarting this

To steal some text from Wikipedia:Naming conventions (aircraft):

For article titles, use the most common unambiguous name. A central tenet of wikipedia naming conventions is to give articles names that will be have the greatest chance of being directly linked to within an edit window of another article. Alternative names should be listed in bold type on or near the first line of the article as well as in the "aka" field of the infobox if it is used. See also Wikipedia:Google test.

Create redirects from all the more common alternative names. For example, the main article for the Dodge Caravan should be at Dodge Caravan; redirects to it at Dodge Grand Caravan, Plymouth Voyager, and Chrysler Town and Country.

Never use a generic name like "Chrysler minivans" or a hybrid name like "Dodge Caravan/Plymouth Voyager" since these violate the Wikipedia policy of using common and familiar names. See also Wikipedia:Naming conventions.

We need to get this policy up on Wikipedia:Naming conventions. It's been discussed recently at Lincoln MKZ and Chevrolet Silverado, among others... --SFoskett 14:43, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

• I started a discussion about this topic at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Automobiles#Articles of Similar Vehicles in an attempt to reach a uniform decision and standard format for all relevant articles. After all, isn't that what the project aims to do after all? Airline 23:10, 13 February 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Military vehicles

I've just drawn up an initial proposal at Wikipedia:Naming conventions (military vehicles), based on discussion at the Military History wikiproject's Weaponry Task Force. It refers editors to this policy regarding automobiles & trucks. Please have a look and comment. —Michael Z. 2006-08-15 20:37 Z