Talk:Windows "Fiji"

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[edit] New article

Hi, I rewrote the article at Windows Fiji and tried to find as much additional info as I could, but information is pretty scarce right now. Hope this doesn't have to be speedily deleted because of copy-pasting like the old article. Rafert 18:06, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Not necessarily speedily, but I suspect it will be deleted nevertheless, and I have proposed its deletion. All Wikipedia articles must be Verifiable from Reliable Sources. This seems to be a collection of rumors culled together from blogs and forums, none of which can be deemed reliable. Fan-1967 18:08, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

While I was hesitant to use the jameskyton blog, I believe there is certainly something at Microsoft codenamed Fiji. Paul Thurrott's WinSuperSite is a well known and reliable site for example, covering news about and testing Codename Longhorn/Vista when it was in it's early alpha stages[1]. Softpedia and Microsoft Watch are also more credible IMO than just some guy's blog. Slashdot also has an article about Fiji[2] but I didn't reference it because the pclaunches.com site it refers to seems to be down. Another solution would be to delete all the rumors that come from the jameskyton blog and tag the article as a stub. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rafert (talk • contribs) 18:20, 2 January 2007 (UTC).

Unfortunately, "there is certainly something at Microsoft codenamed Fiji" is probably the sum total of what can be said definitively and verifiably, and that's not enough for an article. Softpedia and MS Watch may be more reliable than your average blog, but still don't fall into the Reliable Source category. Fan-1967 18:23, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

You have a point there, but the problem with rumors is that they don't show up in print so fast. Oh well, delete it if that's what must be done. I did what I thought was a useful contribution at the time :) Rafert 18:35, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

That's the problem with trying to crystal-ball. Much of what you find is educated guesses, which may well turn out to be true, but are sometimes disastrously wrong, like the recent iPhone fiasco. Thousands of websites, blogs and forums defiantly and assuredly proclaimed that`Apple was releasing a product by that name. Turned out they didn't even own the name, and Cisco released an iPhone. Fan-1967 18:40, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

And lo, Apple announced the iPhone. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.89.114.153 (talk) 13:17, 26 January 2007 (UTC).

The {{hangon}} is not justified. There is nothing other than speculation from various pundits who are all getting information from their own asses, or from eachother (same thing). Microsoft, either as an official PR statement, or via blogs, has said precisely nothing about "Fiji"; they have, however, mentioned Windows "Vienna" in a number of presentations and discussion forums, so it's safe to say that such a project exists. We've deleted this article a number of times already on the basis that there are no Wikipedia:Reliable sources that can positively identify Windows Fiji as something that exists. Nothing has changed other than the fact that some anonymous person with a wordpress blog, and clearly no connection to Microsoft, got the attention of a web site, and it snowballed from there. -/- Warren 18:51, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

You're right that a lot of sites are using the info posted at the jameskyton blog and that the blogosphere exploded because of that. But like I said above, that isn't the only clue to the Fiji codename I found. The MS Watch article was from April 2006. The Paul Thurrott article with the kernel 6.1 rumor was written almost two months before the jameskyton blog. Charlie Owen (got his name from the Softpedia newsitem) is the program manager for Windows Media Center (searched his name at MSDN), and his blog moved from [3] to [4]. A blog requesting feedback on Media Center just a week after the Vista RTM is tagged with 'Fiji'[5]. I'd say that the last two indications, from a journalist that has close ties with MS, and from a honcho at MS respectively, are not to be thrown away like Average Joe's blog. Rafert 19:30, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Still not Wikipedia:Reliable Sources. Period. Fan-1967 19:31, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

You could deletes half of the articles here if WP:RS is that important. And mr. Olsen wouldn't tag a blog with Fiji if it had something to do with it, don't you think? Rafert 19:57, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

You're certainly welcome to help out Wikipedia by nominating for deletion any article that doesn't have good sources in it... few editors have problems with such content being deleted! -/- Warren 00:05, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Any article lacking Reliable Sources, if challenged, must be either deleted or trimmed back to only that content whiich can be reliably sourced and verified. For this one, I don't believe there is any content at all that can be. We can't even really produce a reliably verifiable stub. Fan-1967 16:07, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Aye. There's another issue here, though -- if this "Fiji" project is purported to be a service pack for Vista, why would it even deserve a separate article? We don't have a separate article for, say, XP SP2 or the individual point-upgrades on XP Media Center... -/- Warren 17:57, 3 January 2007 (UTC)