User talk:Elviajero

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[edit] Image copyright status in Madurai article

Can you please update the image with it's copyright status? The referenced site seems to suggest that the photo might not be released under any of the licenses that would allow us to use it. Refer to WP:IUP for more information. Calvinkrishy 13:18, Apr 13, 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Madurai

Hi, I've replied your queries at Talk:Madurai. Also, I wish to bring Madurai to a featured article status by following the guidelines at Wikipedia:Wikiproject Indian cities. Can we do that? -- Sundar ^{\talk \contribs} July 8, 2005 05:26 (UTC)

[edit] 100-word list for Sourashtri

Good day! Could you help me and provide Sourashtri translations for the following 100 basic word. If there are sinonyms or known dialectal variants provide them with comments if possible. Also please indicate if you know that certain words are borrowing. You can fill in right here and then I can delete the list form here or you could save it in archive if you like. Thank you in advance! --Koryakov Yuri 12:40, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi Yuri! I will be glad to help you with this. However, I'm not sure how to get the sounds across to you. As I'm not familiar with IPA, I have used a phonetic scheme commonly used to represent Sourashtra sounds. In this scheme,

• When a vowel is stressed, it's capitalized.
• The consonant 'k' is used in place of hard 'c' sounds.
• The consonants 't' and 'd' are never sharp unless specified and are pronounced more like in Romance languages.
• The vowel 'a', unlike in English where it's pronounced 'ey', has a simple 'a' sound.
• Similarly, the vowel 'u' doesn't morph into an 'a' sound as it sometimes does in English and normally has an 'oo' sound.
• Other vowels: 'i' has an 'e' sound; 'e' is pronounced 'ay'.

• I, me – mI (mee)
• thou (you, 2nd sg) – tumhI (tumhee)

Note: Modern English uses 'you' to refer to second person singular as well as plural. As you've noted, 'thou' used to be used for second singular, but no longer. Besides, 'you' also multitasks while addressing strangers or with respect. Sourashtra, unlike English, but more like Romance languages, has the following forms for singular, plural, and respectful in second person.

Singular & familiar - tu
Singular & respectful - tumhI
Plural & familiar, Plural & respectful - tumhI

• we – amhI (amhee)
• this – ellE (el-ley) (Madurai dialect - MDU), iyo (Dindigul dialect - DGL)
• that – tellE (not tell-e, but thel-ley) (MDU), tyo (DGL)
• who? – kOn
• what? – kAi, kAya
• not – nhI (nhee)
• all – askI (not ask-I, but askee)
• many – jhukU
• one – ontyO (sharp 't')
• two – diyyO
• big – mothO
• long – lambU (not lamb-YOU, but lamboo)
• small – nhannO
• woman – beil menik (MDU), beil meni (DGL)
• man (adult male) – dalla menik (MDU), dalla meni (DGL)
• man (human being) – menik, menkO (both MDU), meniv (DGL)
• fish – mhali
• bird – pakshi (Not commonly used; instead the borrowed Tamil equivalent 'paravai' is used.)
• dog – sunO
• louse – (Was that house?) - ghEr
• tree – jhAd (sharp 'd')
• seed – vithU
• leaf – pAn
• root – mUl
• bark (of a tree) – Word extinct in modern Sourashtra. Equivalent Tamil word 'pattai' is used.
• skin – toudO (sharp 'd')
• meat (flesh) – chainO (to refer to mutton), kendO (Human flesh)
• blood – regat
• bone – hadkO (sharp 'd')
• fat – mandO
• egg – andO (sharp 'd')
• horn – Word extinct in modern Sourashtra. Equivalent Tamil word 'konbu' is used.
• tail – pusidi (sharp 'd')
• feather (of a bird) – rekkE
• hair – khesh
• head – doskO
• ear – kAn
• eye – dolO
• nose – nAg
• mouth – tOn
• tooth – dAt
• tongue – jIb
• claw (nail) – neku
• foot – paulO
• knee – gutkO (sharp 't')
• hand – hAt
• belly – pOd (sharp 'd')
• neck – gelO
• breast(s) (of a woman) – dudO
• heart – hEm
• liver – tilji, kajali
• drink (verb) – pE
• eat (verb) – khA
• bite (verb) – chAu
• see (verb) – sA
• hear (verb) – aik
• know (verb) – kalAd (sharp 'd')
• sleep (verb) – inji
• die (verb) – mOr
• kill (verb) – mOrAd (sharp 'd')
• swim (verb) – Verb extinct. Tamil equivalent 'nInd' is used.
• fly (verb) – hUd (sharp 'd')
• walk/go (verb) – chAl
• come (verb) – Av
• lie (down) (verb) – pOd (lie), khalla pOd (sharp 'd')
• sit (verb) – bIs
• stand (verb) – nhibbI
• give (verb) – dE
• say (verb) – mhEn, sang (tell)
• sun – surit
• moon – chendAm
• star – natchatru
• water – pani
• rain – pOus
• stone – gundO (Crude stone), deidO (Carved stone) (second 'd' sharp in both)
• sand – matti
• earth – bhUyi, bhOyi (Ground), bhUmi (Earth as a whole)
• cloud – mEg
• smoke – dhUm
• fire – hulO (MDU), istav (DGL)
• ash – asti (To refer to remains after cremation), rAk (To refer to remains of burnt coal or wood)
• burn (trans. verb) – jEl
• road (path) – vAd (sharp 'd')
• mountain – dongar
• red – lhovvO (MDU), rhovvO (DGL)
• green – pachE (Borrowed from Tamil)
• yellow – manjal (Borrowed from Tamil)
• white – hujAl
• black – kalO
• night – rAt
• warm (hot) – hunnO
• cold – sullO
• full – bhOr
• new – novvO
• good – chokat (sharp 't')
• round – vattam (Borrowed from Tamil)
• dry – sukhi
• name – nAv

Hope it helps. Please revert if you have any questions.
Elviajero 18:38, 30 October 2006 (UTC)

Dear, Elviajero! Thank you very much.

I have only few questions more:

• What is sharp t & d? Are there equivalent sounds in Tamil (see Tamil_language#Consonants)? Are they alveolar, retroflex or something else?
  • Sharp t is as in tight and sharp d is as in dance. When softened, these are more like t in thin and d in this. These sounds are approximations although they are quite close. - Elviajero 19:58, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

• So, ghEr is louse or house? Do you know what is louse? (it's a kind of insect that sometimes live in head-hair, plural is lice). Cf. Hindi jũ.
  • I'm sorry, my mistake. ghEr is a house and louse is called jUm (pronounced joom). Lice would be jUmun. - Elviajero 19:58, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

• Is there a neutral word for meat: not mutton, pork or human, but just a meat? Cf. mÃs in Gujarati and Marathi or gošt in Hindi.
  • You set me thinking with this. For most people in India, meat is either mutton or chicken and Sourashtrians are no exception. I guess 'chainO' can be used to refer to all meats. It can be prefixed with the animal's name to make it specific. For example:
    • Goat meat or mutton - bhendu chainO or shortly chainO (as this is the most common meat)
    • Chicken - kudi chainO or shortly kudi (maybe to differentiate it from mutton)
    • Beef - goru chainO
    • Pork - dukkaru chainO
  • Interestingly, in Dindigul dialect, 'chainO' almost always refers to chutney (a type of sauce served with steamed rice cakes and pancakes), although they are aware that it can also refer to meat. The primary word for meat is 'bosulO' in that dialect. It can be prefixed with the animal's name to make it specific (bhendu bosulO or bosulO for mutton, goru bosulO for beef, and dukkar bosulO for pork)
  • Neither 'chainO' or 'bosulO' can be used to refer to human flesh. The correct word is 'kendO' (d as in 'dance'). If you really want to refer to human meat (I hope not!), I guess it can be called 'menik chainO' or 'menkeA chainO'. - Elviajero 19:58, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

• What is Sourashtra name for Sourashtra language? And how do you pronounce the first vowel in this word?
  • Sourashtrians never refer to themselves so while talking amongst themselves. In Madurai, they call themselves 'aura jAd' (literally, our caste or community), 'aura tenU' (literally, our people), or a little more formally, 'palkAr'. The language is called 'aura vatO' (literally, our speech). The term 'Sourashtra' is used both for the community and language while interacting with Tamils and others.
    
  • 'Sourashtra' is pronounced 'savrAshtra' (sav-raashtra). The 'sou' part sounds like 'su' in 'sun' and 've' in 'give'. - Elviajero 19:58, 2 November 2006 (UTC)

--Koryakov Yuri 12:13, 1 November 2006 (UTC)