Talk:Pork

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Contents 1 There's a shocker. 2 Controversy 3 Smallgoods? 4 Rap 5 Pork Pictures! 6 Cooking Pork 7 Caught with the apple 8 Talk Pork 9 The "Pork with worm" urban legend

[edit] There's a shocker.

Is it really necessary to state that vegetarians don't eat pork "and all other meats" in this article?

[edit] Controversy

I really think a controversy page should be added to this article.

[edit] Smallgoods?

What does "smallgoods" mean? I can't find a definition of the term anywhere. When I search for it on Google, all I find is links to the Australian meat industry, and a band called The Smallgoods. Is it an Australian term for preserved meats? --64.165.112.146 19:13, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

Try Googling for "smallgoods definition". This result (PDF) says it's "used in New Zealand and Australia to describe a range of processed meat products". --Heron 19:44, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Rap

Does anyone know why a lot of artists (rap artists, in partucular... see http://www.thesmokinggun.com/backstagetour/) don't eat pork?

Alot of Jewish and Muslim stars maybe?

How come so many rappers (50 Cent, Fat Joe, Xzibit etc.) don't eat pork... according to thesmokinggun.com's backstage tour report?

This may be a cultural/ethnic thing. Some African Americans persuing their ethno-cultural African roots decide to become muslims and thus have religious reasons not to eat pork. Add copycat wannabes and you got a trend.

Other than that? No idea. I'd wager most of them do it for ideological reasons, though. Few people who specifically don't eat pork (rather than meat in general) do so for health reasons alone. -- Ashmodai 02:15, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

Actually, pork consumption is fairly uncommon in Africa, no matter one's religion or creed. It is a cultural trait that also crossed over into the United States during the era of slavery and became more prevalent during the civil rights era much later. SouthernComfort 02:51, 18 March 2006 (UTC)

Pork also has a reputation as a "poor man's meat" in the USA. Reaction against this might be a factor.Dogface 01:46, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Pork Pictures!

I'am discusted by how you show the pork picture of the ribs and stuff. --Jingofetts 20:21, 29 December 2005 (UTC) get a nicer one.

That's what pork looks like. Get used to it. Yum! --Heron 19:47, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

That's a pig that's been sliced open- a carcass. Pork is something that's cut up into chops or some sort other preparation. Big difference. --65.27.34.181 00:21, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

Agreed! If you are looking for pork, you should see pictures of pork, not happy cartoon pigs. The pictures disgust me too--that's why I don't eat animals. If you want to eat pork and pretend it's plucked off trees ready-to-eat, then you shouldn't go looking it up on Wikipedia. NTK 17:47, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

There's a balance---Wikipedia articles should be informative, not pushing a particular point of view. When I saw the pig-carcass picture as the first one on the page, I guessed immediately that it was inserted by a vegetarian, and it seems that I was correct. It should be on this page further down, but "pork" as a food (which is what this page is about) is more directly illustrated by a dish or cooked meat, which is what ought to be first. See the example on beef. --Delirium 10:18, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

Sorry Mr. Squeamish Porkeater, but you are jumping to conclusions. The image was added by User:David.Monniaux, a French Wikipedian who took the picture. There is nothing to indicate that David is vegetarian--in all probability he is not. Same goes for Heron, who as far as I can tell was perfectly sincere in his wholehearted "Yum!" Pork comes from pigs. We can have pictures of pigs in the article, we can have pictures of neatly wrapped pork cuts and cooked pork dishes (both of which are present), but the lead picture is most representative. Pork is "pig as meat," and the image of pork halfs, in their intermediate stage between live pig and prepared dish, is most representative of "pig as meat." So there's no need to be defensive. I've never edited this article, and I'm not aware of any vegetarians who have inserted any vegetarian views at all. NTK 01:37, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Besides, if anything the pig halves image is not particularly explicit. I've found some good images from the USDA. (At your suggestion, added one to the Beef article). Here's one that could be used here: NTK 15:01, 29 January 2006 (UTC)

The current picture is a bit weird -- halves of pigs hanging out in the open public? I don't mind pics of sliced pigs ending up in this article (pork comes from pigs after all -- and I don't have a problem with following nature's way there and eating dead animal parts) but there HAS to be a more apropos image for the introduction.

"Pork" refers more commonly to the actual meat (prepared or not) than the corpse itself (gutted and sliced, or not), so that's what the introduction should probably show. Although not advocating censorship, I would also suggest considering what kind of pictures will actually ADD to the article, rather than just shock/educate/etc meat lovers and/or veggies. You don't need to show detail photos of a bypass operation in order to illustrate an article on the human heart or heart surgery if a sketch/diagram does the job.

Yes, turning a dead pig into pork is a messy process, but there's a reason we don't have rotten.com-style photos on the articles about cannibalism, self mutilation or manslaughter, or pornographic photos on the sex-related articles. I don't mind the gruesomeness, but I know that a fair amount of people (veggies and carnis alike) do and don't want to be distracted by explicit imagery while reading an article. At least the current photo doesn't have all those guts hanging out of the corpses -- I guess that'd be the kind of thing that would turn most people off.

Adding NPOV pictures to NPOV articles can still have an POV effect -- simply because it creates a context that can be exploited for POV purposes. This is what creates the difference between documentation and propaganda (intentionally or not). -- Ashmodai 02:08, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

The picture just makes me feel hungry, to be honest. I think it's an excellent one and quite like it where it is. Clearly I'm not cut out to be a vegetarian, though (or a Muslim). Palmiro | Talk 11:03, 21 February 2006 (UTC)

I like pig! Pig tastes good! Seeing whole pigs hanging makes me want to fire up my smoker! Keep the picture. Dogface 04:16, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

If you can't handle the picture, then you, along with the people who want to read about clitorises without seeing naughty bits, have the option of browsing with images turned off, and enabling them selectively. We don't eliminate on-point, non-gratuitous, informative and relevant content because someone might have a weak stomach. If you don't like it, don't look at it. Don't say that it shouldn't be shown. NTK 03:50, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

Keep the picture and add a picture of a roast suckling pig with an apple in its mouth. Rmhermen 04:21, 4 April 2006 (UTC)

Impressive diversity of views here. My opinion is that the picture should stay, but be switched with one of the other pictures from further down the page. I agree with part of what Delirium said above; when most people hear the word "pork", they think of prepared meat. So for most people, an image of prepared pork best represents "pork". To a butcher, a farmer, or an animal rights activist, the image of the sliced pig might be better representative of "pork", but for most people it's more representative of where pork comes from than of pork itself. --Allen 20:09, 29 April 2006 (UTC)

Yes, NTK, my comment was sincere, but now I think that a comprise might be necessary. We are never going to please everybody, because there are different perceptions of animal products around the world. In some societies, people are used to seeing pigs' carcasses hanging up in butchers' shops or on their own farms, so they would not find the carcass photo remarkable. At the other extreme, there are probably urban societies where people only ever see meat in brand-named plastic packs. For balance, why don't we put the middle of the range, i.e. prepared cuts, at the top of the article, then introduce the two extremes, i.e. carcasses and the plastic-wrapped stuff, later? And yes, seriously, there should be a pic of a roast suckling pig with an apple in its mouth, and all the other pork products we can think of. --Heron 16:15, 22 July 2006 (UTC)

I vote to keep the picture. Since we cannot taste the picture, the only way to show how pork look like is to show part of the pig too. If anyone cannot handle how pork really looks like, they should stay away from the butcher markets. If anyone cannot face facts and reality, they should stay away from wikipedia. Reality is not always pretty. Kowloonese 01:07, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

I understand the intention behind the split pig that opens this article, but I think it's a bit too graphic. The description of how pork is "gathered," so to speak, is rather clear in its own right. A Picture seems a bit unnecessary. "Just because you like the burger doesn't mean you want to meet the cow."

No Problem ! I fixed it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 217.146.104.65 (talk • contribs).

I've reverted the change. Per WP:NOT#Wikipedia is not censored, being "put off" by an image that is obviously relevant is not a valid reason for its removal. A single image of pork just before it is jointed is appropriate, topical, and not particularly shocking. --Eyrian 17:42, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Cooking Pork

I recently went to a restaurant where they "by default" cook pork "medium" unless the customer requests otherwise. This was the first time I ever heard of anyone not fully cooking pork. What are the implications of eating undercooked pork? Are there cuisines where undercooked pork is usual? Kimonandreou 15:51, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

The reason pork is commonly cooked all the way through is that eating raw pork can cause Trichinosis caused by trichinella. Cooking pork all the way through kills trinchella.

Pigs get trichinella the same way humans do: by eating infected meat. Therefore, undercooked pork is unlikely to pose much of a risk unless pigs are being fed undercooked meat themselves. That is, that they are swill or scrap fed, or are exposed to garbage (or are grown in somebody's backyard or allowed to roam free range through an unsecured paddock or similar). Swill feeding is now banned in some parts of the world and this considerably reduces disease risk.

And, in addition, the undercooked meat the pigs may eat would have to have been exposed to Trinchinella itself. So the prevalence of trinchinella in a region or area will influence how important it is to cook pork through. For example, in Australia, where I am from, Trinchinella does not exist so it is fine to cook pork "medium". I think that this is commonly done here and I've seen it recommended in cook books. There is also now no trinchinella in the UK.

I think there are cultures in some parts of China, Laos, Thailand or South-East Asia that have raw pork as part of their cuisines. -203.129.45.178 11:20, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

Why does this article make no mention of trichinosis?JaderVason 23:33, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Unknown. I've added it. --Eyrian 23:46, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

Someone famous contracted trichinosis and tried to sue the restaurant before they died. I read it recently but can't remember who it was.--Moonlight Mile 11:23, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Caught with the apple

I'm looking for a picture of one of a roast pig's head with an apple stuck in its mouth. It's one of the few illustrations I can think of that would be suitable for the otherwise picture-less subtlety. If anyone knows of any, please post the link at talk:subtlety.

Peter ^Isotalo 13:09, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Talk Pork

Haha, that's funny. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.69.80.47 (talk) 22:35, 11 January 2007 (UTC).

[edit] The "Pork with worm" urban legend

You'll find this by searching Pork + Cola. It's an urban legend that's said if you pour cola on raw porks, worms will start showing up. I think this should be added to the wiki page. Lightblade 10:35, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia is not the place for false rumors, unless they rise to significant prominence in reliable sources. --Eyrian 14:11, 31 March 2007 (UTC)