Talk:Love hotel

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Love hotel is part of WikiProject Japan, a project to improve all Japan-related articles. If you would like to help improve this and other Japan-related articles, please join the project. All interested editors are welcome.

This article has been rated as B-Class on the quality scale.

Japan To-do:

1 Removal of prostitution box
2 Love hotel architecture
3 The fact about Nintendo
4 Lack of refences??

[edit] Removal of prostitution box

The "prostitution in Japan" box certainly is not irrelevant. What do you benefit from censoring the article like this? --DannyWilde 12:47, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

Comment - While I don't doubt the link between love hotels and prostitution is a very real one, I think the statement that it is "mainly used" for purposes of prostitution needs to be sourced somewhere. — MC MasterChef :: Leave a tip — 12:57, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

That may have been an overreaction, since I have no proof that the main business of love hotels is prostitution. However, prior to this edit, the page actually said that the main business was catering to married couples. This is utter tosh. It might as well have said the main business was catering to leprechauns. Many of the prostitution ads around my area specifically state "hoteru", and a Google search will turn up plenty more evidence. Anyway. --DannyWilde 13:15, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

I don't know about married necessarily, but I am, ahem, familiar with the argument that love hotels are sometimes used by steady couples as a sort of "retreat". I don't know how much hard evidence you can find for this, given the nature of the business, but it's actually a pretty popular claim: [1] [2] [3], for example. I think clientele probably depends a great deal on the area and hotel. Can the lead be reworded to reflect both realities? — MC MasterChef :: Leave a tip — 13:35, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

It's true that they're used by unmarried couples, because most Japanese young people live with their parents. I doubt you'll find many married couples in them though, that is just a kind of fig leaf. I suppose the low price places are more associated with prostitution, judging from the signs all over the place, or maybe the fancy ones clean up or something. Near my house there are three of the places. I found some pages in a Google search which seemed to think that love hotels are a kind of jolly place which everyone would like built next door to their house. A lot of guide books to Japan have this kind of "jolly" feel to the discussion too. It just isn't true, most Japanese people aren't at all proud or even tolerant of love hotels, and covering up the dark side of love hotels and making them out to be "jolly" places, used by married couples, which everyone accepts with a wink and a nod, is not a good idea in my opinion. --DannyWilde 14:14, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

Where's this "most" coming from again? Punch ファッションホテル into Google and see what you get: a ton of squeaky-clean search engines and review sites ([4] [5] [6] [7] ...) aimed at status-conscious mostly female customers looking for the perfect ending to the perfect date. Methinks you've been tripped up by the euphemism treadmill: these days ラブホ has the same connotations as "cheap motel", while ファッション・ブティックなどなど are more in line with "romantic hotel". I see Hyatt advertising packages for couples, should we engage in hand-wringing about "the dark side" because the same rooms are used by the resident prostitutes in the hotel bar?

Also, I think the married couple thing may previously have been more true, as after the war families lived in very, very crowded conditions and there was little privacy to be had. Japanese apartments are still cramped, but these days you'll be hard put to find parents and (older) kids sleeping in the same room anymore.

To be honest, I'm not particularly interested in what you think or speculate. --DannyWilde 10:03, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

So why bother replying to me at all? Jpatokal 12:36, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

One more thing to consider: the article in the Japanese version, which is generally admirably frank in its discussion of sexual matters, doesn't mention prostitution at all. They even have this to say about why they exist:

Why do you think this is admirably frank? I read the article from beginning to end, and there is nothing in it which strikes me as being "admirably frank", just fairly basic information, mostly about the differences between a love hotel and a normal one. --DannyWilde 10:03, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

The Japanese Wikipedia as a whole is admirably frank. Exhibit A. Jpatokal 12:36, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

「欧米には同種のものはないため、海外の雑誌記事でも日本紹介の特集の中でも取り上げられることがある。日本の狭小な住宅事情と関連させて論じられることもある。」

So the "small houses" thing comes up here too, but the article doesn't really say if it's an actual reason or just the usual reason used in foreign articles to explain it... Jpatokal 15:50, 23 October 2005 (UTC)

It only says that is the reason used to explain it, it says nothing about "an actual reason". --DannyWilde 10:03, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Yes, that would be exactly what just I said. Jpatokal 12:36, 30 October 2005 (UTC)

Someone added the box back today. I'd just like to note that it wasn't me using an anonymous address. Jpatokal made a very good point on my talk page, which was that, unlike the other entries on the list, the love hotel itself is not a form of prostitution, although it may have a connection. I'm ambivalent about adding the box to the article again myself. Although there is a connection, perhaps the "love hotel" entry should be struck from the box too. I originally found the entry for esute which was suggesting that this was a form of prostitution, which isn't true at all, and I started cleaning up the box and its entries from that point of view. Anyway. --DannyWilde 04:06, 4 November 2005 (UTC)

[edit] Love hotel architecture

It's the interior architecture/decorating that's usually famed for garishness, not the external, right? — MC MasterChef :: Leave a tip — 00:05, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

I know people in the Japanese construction industry who've built love hotels, and they tell me that the interiors of many of them aren't particularly garish. Anyway, the current version talks about the hotel itself being shaped like a boat. --DannyWilde 00:10, 31 October 2005 (UTC)

I've been going out with the same japanese woman for almost 2 years and we've gone to love hotels because she (and I) lives with her parents. It wasn't a "fashion hotel", but it certainly wasn't garish, and had a real person behind a desk to pay, etc. I think this article might be making a few too many generalizations with the descriptions.

"Love hotels have multiple complex entrances ...." That photo caption seems like yet another overbroad generalization. In my (admittedly limited) experience, they have regular front entrances, nothing very complicated except (in many cases) a wall in front of the door with two ways around it, perhaps so that a couple can exit at the same time but in different directions (which doesn't amount to much cover as far as I'm concerned.) I'd go with "Some love hotels ...." Any thoughts from those with more sample experiences?

Michael Turner 11 August 2006

Most all love hotels I've seen have a front entrance for pedestrians and a back entrance for drivers. Jpatokal 04:29, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

[edit] The fact about Nintendo

The article for Hiroshi Yamauchi implies that he (a former president of the company) once ran one BEFORE going to work for Nintendo, not that Nintendo itself once ran one. I'm inclined to believe the article on Yamayuchi is correct, but could someone else clarify the (seemingly useless) fact in this article? Evan1109