Talk:Vestal Virgin
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[edit] Earlier Problems
- Virgins and other classical period priestesses etc on the Women as theological figures page (or equivalent page if title updated).
Jackiespeel 21:05, 1 October 2005 (UTC)
Whoever had their filthy hand in writing this page should not "put a few details of the vestal virgins and other classical period priestesses etc on the .... page" as Jackiespeel requested above.
I read what is on this article and I have become nauseaus. Absolutely disgusting. Awfull. There is an inference that the Roman Mob created vestal Virgins as their toys. This page is so gruesome, but true only because thats what the Romans Empirerers did when they roamed around and smashed up antiquity.
Everything that is there right now needs to be put into brackets of how the Romans treated Anciently Established Centers of Culture and Wisdom. This needs to be fixed quick. As it is, it is as though the Emporer of Rome created the Senate and then closed down the Senate: Huh?
So, if some one gets to this space nauseaus as I have and things aren't straightened out yet: Mothers, young women, wives, grandmothers were all keepers of the Flame and they came and went as they felt called. They didn't have to be 'sexual-virgins'. If the Emporers were sadists fine, but that is going to have to be boxed into a 'destruction of the order of devotees of The Virgin, the keepers of the Holy Fire of The Virgin' section.
I would fix this now, but I am made woozy from what I have seen while reading that. *excuse me for my strong reaction: I do not want to offend whoever put the page up, I am not impugning your efforts, and the material is all verifiable as it comes out of Smith's, and so on... kylconnors@yahoo.com 2,11,06
- Kylconners - I don't really understand what you're saying. First and foremost, which article are you talking about? Vestal Virgin? Or Women as theological figures?
- What are the "Anciently Established Centers of Culture and Wisdom?" The Vestal Virgins? Is that your own terminology?
- What do you mean "put in brackets?" To denote that it's unsure?
- Who is Smith? A classicist of some kind?
- More importantly, I believe you're mistaken when you say that "Mothers, young women, wives, grandmothers were all keepers of the Flame and they came and went as they felt called." The code of the Vestal Virgins was extremely strict - Plutarch, I believe, in one of the early Roman lives (I bet Romulus, but I haven't read it recently enough to be able to tell you for sure) says that if a Vestal broke her vow of chastity before her thirty-year term was up, she could be buried alive, and there's an example there too. If you can give ancient sources that say otherwise - i.e. that there were given some kind of sexual license - I'm sure we'd be happy to hear.
- Also, note that Augustus - arguably the first emperor - died in 14 B.C., and the flame was put out in 391 A.D. That's more than 400 years, longer than the amount of time from the founding of Jamestown to the present day. The Emperors were not exactly running around helter-skelter trying to ruin antiquity, as you seem to imply. Or at least not all of them.
- A few spelling notes: nauseous, awful, and Emperor(s).
--Dd42 05:44, 15 March 2006 (UTC)
- "Roman Catholic practise of celibate nuns stems from Rome's Vestal Virgins." This seems a pat and naive oversimplification. Can this sentence be made more useful? --Wetman 02:12, 25 June 2006 (UTC)
"Some speculate" That's sounds POV. How about some references. Indeed, the Catholic Church would say that ritual celibacy was already known to the Jewish people before the birth of Christ- that the Virgin Mary may have even been one herself. Hardly a Roman invention then.
Several of the privileges listed in the privileges section are direct quotes from http://www.angelfire.com/va2/vestalvirgins. I don't feel qualified to fix this, since my first instinct would be to reword them, but I doubt the credibility of the source enough that I fear rewording them would make it seem as if they were verifiably true. Help, please? VanillaCreem 14:53, 2 August 2006 (UTC)
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- The only course I can see is to remove the offending sentences. Does anyone have another idea? (I must say I find it disturbing that blatant plagirism can go unnoticed for so long...) Jim whitson
[edit] Problem with sources in History section
There are currently some citations in the History section do not have sources in the References section. The edit goes back to olid 12064349 (See http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vestal_Virgin&direction=next&oldid=12064088), "Vestal Virgin" Revision as of 21:18, 8 April 2005 by Ccson (talk | contribs). CcSon removed the added the following website http://www.suppressedhistories.net/secret_history/patriapotestas.html . The edit after that one, removed this source.
When you match the side by side, you can tell it is plagerism. In the original source, the full citations are not given. This is not even verifiable plagerism. I will also mark the History section of the page dubious until this matter is resolved. I find bad that this has remained in the article for this long without being detected. -- MicahDCochran 20:37, 21 January 2007 (UTC)
[edit] Speculation
On a 2005 BBC documentary about life in ancient Rome, they stated that "Vestal Virgins" were considered to be joined to the family of Rome by marriage and that sex with them was considered incest. They also claimed that the emperor was considered the high priest of the Cult of Vesta. Upon hearing I started to think about the similarities between vestal virgins and Roman Catholic nuns. Just a bit of speculation on my part. --Neilrieck 15:44, 17 March 2007 (UTC)
- Consecrated, not "married". The Pontifex Maximus was their appointed guardian: the emperors assumed that title, as did the Bishops of Rome. --Wetman 01:00, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
- Thanks for that clarification. Still, some of the similarities between ancient Rome and the modern Roman Catholic church seem more than accidental. --Neilrieck 12:22, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
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- Well, clues in the name, I suppose- the Roman Catholic Church did evolve, more or less directly, from pre-existing Roman religious system. Its not a stretch of the imagination to assume that the new Catholic Church's founders were influenced, in terms of structure, by what they already had and did. Patch86 22:31, 19 March 2007 (UTC)
