Talk:Sleep

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• Archive 1

SOMEONE HAS BEEN DESTROYING THIS ARTICLE!!!!

Check out what they edited: Theories regarding the function of sleep

Given sleep's heterogeneous nature, no single theory predominates, as it is difficult to describe one single "function" of sleep.

   * Restorative i have the best friends theories i luv Chris Brothman so much of sleep describe sleep as a dynamic time of healing and growth for organisms.

OBVIOUSLY that is an act of bandalism!!!! I am sorry, I only surfed wikipedia INTO the article, but I cannot correct it by my own... PLEASE! someone DO SOMETHING!!!

Contents 1 Preservation and Protection 2 Night terrors 3 Class Reference 4 This guy who never sleeps 5 Picture covering text 6 Copied material 7 Mistake in the article? 8 Other animals 9 Sleep less 10 Picture 11 Open eyed sleep 12 How to stay awake 13 Unsourced statements, speculation, and claims 14 Frequesncy of EEG in second stage 15 sleeping to answer questions 16 Article is the wrong way round 17 Missing word in second sentence? 18 Sleep not a form of "unconsciousness"? 19 Snoozing 20 Sentence makes no sense 21 innaccuracy in first sentence 22 Compound 23 Need to reduce the weasels here 24 Animals probably aren't "anthropology" 25 Footnoting style 26 Amount of Required Sleep for Teens is Wrong 27 Prominent Figures and Sleep 28 Dream timing contradiction 29 Necessary for life? 30 Cattle sleep while standing? 31 7 vs. 8 hours 32 Sleep according to age 33 Please fix this!! 34 Whales and dolphins??

[edit] Preservation and Protection

I read that larger animels (those less vulnerable) sleep less than their smaller, more-commonly-preyed-upon counterparts. If true, this is certianly worth mentioning in this section...anyone know?--141.157.106.115 17:13, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Night terrors

The article has a paragraph on night terrors, so I linked it to the Night Terrors page. However, this page and that page have different advice for handling them. Nosedog 04:06, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Class Reference

Sleep falls more under neuroscience than it does psychology. Just my 2cents.

[edit] This guy who never sleeps

Hope this wasn't addressed before, but here The snare 16:09, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

http://www.thanhniennews.com/features/?catid=10&newsid=12673

[edit] Picture covering text

Stage one sleep picture is covering the text. Move it. Skinnyweed 17:47, 3 April 2006 (UTC)

covering what text? The text wraps around the image.. as it does with the other images. What browser are you using? MrSandman

[edit] Copied material

A lot of material on this page sounds like it has been copied directly from some other source without being identified as such. Anyone care to check it out?

Can you point out some examples?

Yes, that, and who are you? BTW, Other sites, including commercial ones, commonly (and sometimes imprudently) lift stuff from wikipedia. This MAY be what you have observed. Sfahey 02:49, 9 April 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Mistake in the article?

I'm no sleep expert, but there seems to be a contradiction. According to the sleep article, it says: "In 1965, California teenager Randy Gardner attempted to resist sleep in an uncontrolled "experiment". As his ordeal progressed he fell into a silent stupor, bringing into doubt whether he was actually awake in any practical sense." But if you look at the Randy Gardner article, it says "On his final day without sleep, Gardner presided over a press conference where he spoke without slurring or stumbling his words and in general appeared to be in excellent health." Clearly one page or the other must be wrong, since in his final day he could not have both been in 'a silent stupor' that brings into doubt whether he was even awake or not, and 'in perfect health', speaking at a press conference, at the same time. Anyone know the real story? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hikaru79 (talk • contribs).

[edit] Other animals

I don't think it's mentioned anywhere else in the article, but if reptiles, amphibians, and the like don't sleep, what do they do? Do they rest at all, or do they partake in an activity similar to sleep? -albrozdude 04:59, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

The jury is still out on that one. They do have "rest" periods, but they do not fit the EEG criteria we use for sleep... at least that is the common consensus. Additionally, there are not many people studying non-mammalian sleep, so we just don't have enough info. MrSandman 13:17, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Why not make a note of this somewhere in the article? --Elgringo18 09:37, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

I did. But someone deleted it. There was an entire section on it. For the sake of brevity though... it was deleted. This article could easily become 50 pages if we wanted to.

[edit] Sleep less

http://health.ucsd.edu/news/2002/02_08_Kripke.html This article recomends 6-7 hours of sleep is better for ones health then eight. I'm not sure whos correct just thought I would point it out. 69.123.96.192 00:00, 3 May 2006 (UTC)Sean

The trick here is to weed out the people who slept more than 8 hours because they were ill, or on medicine that made them sleep more. The authors here do not (probably for this reason) conclude that sleeping longer CAUSED more deaths.Sfahey 03:03, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Picture

Am I the only one that thinks that the picture is unnecessary? Do they even wear pajamas in every country? Does that coincide with the worldview policy? --70.18.54.9 11:54, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Open eyed sleep

Any idea on this? Anyone knows something about it? One day I was travelling, and sleepy... I tryed my best to keep my eyes open to doon't sleep, and looks like I made an HILD (see lucid wikia)... After a time, my father, that was driving said he talked a lot to me and I didn't asnwered, and that I was with my eyes open... And I don't remember he saying anything, so I wasn't really awake... 201.34.228.145 19:04, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

You were probably day dreaming then lol

The only mammal that I know of which sleeps with its eyes open are snakes, since they have no eyelids so they cannot blink either (I think, something like that anyway)--Rob Scrivener 15:38, 2 March 2007 (UTC)

In 'Counting Sheep' by Paul Martin, it is claimed that humans can sleep with eyes open, so long as they're sleep deprived, although the same author would point out that it would only be light sleep (stage 1-2) as we only fall into deep sleep when lying down. Cotard 13:26, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] How to stay awake

Well seeing as there is a section titled "Approaches to sleeping better". Is it correct we should have a section created specifically for techniques on how to stay awake for periods of time. This information would be particuarly helpful to students, and those whose jobs require long or odd hours.

but unfortunately, all the data shows that it is not a good idea.. especially in an academic (learning) situation. It would be redundant as there is a section on the effects of sleep deprivation.

MrSandman

You make a good point MrsSandman but what right do we have to restrict information that we deem harmful? Who are we to judge? The need of staying awake while tired is one many will experience in their life time and so I still argue the case that we should provide some mild tehniques in managing to stay awake as they would be very practical. Also there may be scientific or psychological studies on this would could generate further interest.

Wikipedia is not a cookbook / userguide. _└ ^VodkaJazz / _talk ^┐ 02:00, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Unsourced statements, speculation, and claims

There are a lot of speculative statements and folk medical wisdom in this piece that aren't cited to any source at all. I've tagged a couple of the more egregious offenses, such as the entire section that's mostly just wikipedians listing what they think works without any evidence. Night Gyr 08:43, 11 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes, it might seem like personal experience and probably is but I'm sure at least a few of the suggestions could be sourced somewhere. It has the OR tag so no need to remove it just yet. Skinnyweed 16:48, 22 May 2006 (UTC)

The entire section is ridiculous and is better off being removed. Anyone who wants to add back parts it should be careful to be sure that claims are properly referenced. --SpinyNorman 01:47, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Frequesncy of EEG in second stage

Is it right that the frequecy of EEG in the second stage of sleep is 12= 16 Hz? Its a bit too high, I think. Not too sure.......... Alexsanjoseph

12-16Hz is the frequency of "sleep spindles", which is indicated in the text, and underlined in the representative image. Spindles are the hallmark of Stage 2, which is why they are mentioned.

MrSandman 18:45, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] sleeping to answer questions

i have heard that some sleep to help them remember information or answer a question, is there a name for this, and should this be included in the article --voodoom 03:21, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

see section on functions of sleep. it covers memory consolidation.

MrSandman 18:38, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Article is the wrong way round

The article is currently an article on Human sleep with a small section on Non-human animal sleep (previously, and very mistakenly, called Animal sleep). This article should deal with a wide range of non-human animal sleep--general patterns and motifs--with a small section, linked to a main article, about the specifics of Human sleep. Any ideas how to tackle this problem? I suggest we dump some of the article at Human sleep and fix the remaining sections. --Oldak Quill 02:25, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

..But what is the difference? Humans are primates/mammals. We know more about human sleep than most other animals....and when we refer to human sleep.. we are talking about mammalian sleep.. just as we use the literature from other species to explain human sleep. In addition, people come here to learn about what is familiar to them.. that is.. "our" sleep. If you want to get into more detail, or are seeking other info, reading the original sources is the way to go anyway. MrSandman 22:14, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

No, this article should deal with "sleep" - what it is, how it works, &c. It should discuss the commonalities between all species which sleep with a couple of sections on major divisions (===Reptilian sleep===, ===Avian sleep===, ===Mammalian sleep===, &c.). If species-specific sleep is different/special enough it should be given its own article (eg. Human sleep). Human sleep would describe the human sleep cycle, human dreams, etc. An article shouldn't deal with humans only, unless the article has the word "human" in its title. --Oldak Quill 19:16, 27 July 2006 (UTC)

I agree with "Sandman." I imagine one could make the same argument about "arthritis," "nutrition," "house," etc. and, still, the great bulk of those encyclopedia article as well should be about humans. Sfahey 20:03, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

Well, one *should* make the same arguements about "arthritis" and "nutrition", they are not restricted to humans and should be treated neutrally. I would say that "house" is a human concept (wolves have dens, termites, mounds, etc.) --Oldak Quill 02:31, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Missing word in second sentence?

The second sentence says Sleep is actually "unconsciousness," but rather, [...]. Shouldn't that be "Sleep is not actually unconsciousness. Otherwise, it shouldn't be followed with but rather.

[edit] Sleep not a form of "unconsciousness"?

This is all over the lead paragraph. I would describe sleep as "more than" or "a special form of" unconsciousness. Golly, if you're not conscious of your surroundings while sleeping, you are "unconscious." Sfahey 20:15, 28 July 2006 (UTC)

dictionary defines as "not conscious; without awareness, sensation, or cognition." Sleeping, we lack all these things. I'll add a 'lacking citation' tag to the statement so someone can verify whether it is or isn't unconciousness. --141.157.106.115 17:17, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

People do think during sleep, just very disordered thoughts which we tend not to remember. Also, we are very conscious in dreams, even if - again - we might not always remember them. Furthermore, important stimuli such as our name, an unusual sound or physical sensation, are often enough to rouse us, indicating we are monitoring the environment to a certain extent (although I grant there's a difference between monitoring and being aware of, but I don't want to get bogged down in theorising about the nature of consciousness :-p). Unfortunately am away from home so can't cite any sources on this (!). Will get back later (if I remember) Cotard 13:35, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Snoozing

I'm sure we are all familiar with hitting the snooze button in the morning to get those few extra minutes of sleep! I do it all the time, sometimes for up to an hour. Sometimes, I'm totally unaware of even hitting the snooze button, as though I haven't even woken up. When I evenutally get up, I feel shattered. This morning however, I didn't snooze once, and I feel much more alert. I assume there is something to learn from this!

Does anyone have any thoughts or theories on this?

Thank you Zzzzzzzzzzz

[edit] Sentence makes no sense

In the 'Anthropologies of Sleep' section, there is this sentence: "Sleep may be an actively social time depending on the sleep groupings, with no constraints on noise or activity." In reference to who/how many people one would sleep with. This sentence makes no sense, as one cannot be active, or social, whilst asleep, and the constraints are quite obvious: How much can you conciously do while sleeping? So, why is this here? Slokunshialgo 00:26, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

People may not be social while they are actually sleeping, but are social during the time when people are lying down, preparing for sleep, or other people are sleeping. They sleep, then wake up, the sleep again, and are social during the intervening periods. Peregrine981 18:56, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Unless you think this is a sloppy way to say that people who are "close" maintain/foster this relationship by sleeping together, I vote for deleting it. Sfahey 22:27, 25 September 2006 (UTC)

Well, I think there's more to it than simply "staying close", if you read the source article it talks about how in some societies, nighttime/sleeptime are the times that people get a chance to talk to each other, but also that if there's problems in the community, its a non-confrontational time to take up issues. The point is also that some societies do not have the same requirements for quiet during sleep as others do. Also that sleep may be interupted for social opportunities rather than being purely for rest. Peregrine981 00:36, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

[edit] innaccuracy in first sentence

The first sentence reads:

Sleep is the state of natural rest observed in all mammals, birds, and fish.

but this is not true in all cases, I have heard for example that most sharks do not sleep but continually move throughout their lives because they need to be moving for water to pass through their gills. Sharks are a type of fish.

Sharks are indeed a type of fish, and you are right that most of them need to keep moving; however that doesn't mean they don't sleep or rest in some way while swimming. Ever heard of a person sleep-walking? ~ ONUnicorn^{(Talk|Contribs)}problem solving 17:41, 8 January 2007 (UTC)

IIRC, stationary sharks have been spotted; as far as I remember, no-one offered an explanation for how they were managing to breathe. A more interesting case are dolphins, who need to come up for air at regular intervals. It shows how much (complex) nervous systems need sleep that they've evolved the ability to sleep one cerebral hemisphere at a time. Cotard 13:39, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Compound

I'm looking for a particular medicine that was being tested that permitted patients to remain awake for days at a time. Jachra 23:04, 19 October 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Need to reduce the weasels here

Although sleep is a subject that is still mysterious, with many aspects that cannot be discussed definitively, this article still contains too many examples of weasel words and usage. WP:WEASEL -- 201.51.236.252 11:32, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Animals probably aren't "anthropology"

Sleep habits of cattle, horses, sheep, and other animals should probably not be included in section on "Anthropology of sleep". -- 201.51.236.252 11:43, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Sheep, cattle and horses aren't unique in this, either - all grazing herbivores have this tendency to sleep whilst standing.

[edit] Footnoting style

We definitely need to regularize the footnoting style throughout the article. Wikipedia:Footnotes -- 201.51.236.252 11:48, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Amount of Required Sleep for Teens is Wrong

The National Sleep Foundation says that the required amount of sleep for teens is 8.5 - 9.5 hours NOT 13. (where does that number even come from) this should be changed also I believe (but cannot confirm, that the amount for adults IS closer to six or seven hours depending on the person,not 8.

[edit] Prominent Figures and Sleep

It's pretty widely known that Stanley Kubrick slept for only four hours a night. I've heard that repeated several times and even from Christiane Kubrick. Also Malcolm X was known to sleep for that same amount. Margret Thatcher, I have heard, though I admit to not knowing thing 1 about her - slept for about the same time as those mentioned. Should the article highlight some of this - the prominent figures of history who've been known to produce high quality product for many years, have their sleep in common? I think its terribly fascinating. -Gohst 00:03, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

Thatcher, "high quality product" ??? What do you mean? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 201.19.140.152 (talk) 00:25, 11 December 2006 (UTC).

I mean "I don't know thing 1 about her" - I hardly know anything about my own countries' politics, let alone another's and which happened before I was born. I was using her as an example in the broader point I was trying to make about sleep. What I really mean is that some prominent figures have been known to sleep for a low number of hours each night and that there may be some interesting correlation which might be of use. -Gohst 11:11, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Dream timing contradiction

The article contradicts itself about when dreams occur during sleep. In the sleep phases section, the article says dreams can occur during any phase, not just REM. Then, in the Dream section, the article implies that dreams occur only or mainly in REM. --68.202.66.211 01:36, 10 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] Necessary for life?

The first paragraph of the article states that sleep is necessary for life, but I seem to remember having read somewhere that no one is quite sure if sleep deprivation can cause death. Then again, I've also heard that fatal familial insomnia does cause death via sleep deprivation. Does anyone have any scientific sources stating one or the other? - Doopokko 05:22, 15 December 2006 (UTC)

That's a very good point. I read of a Vietnamese man who hasn't sleep for over three decades. This article truly amazed me, though. --Ishikawa Minoru 22:38, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Animal studies (rats) have shown that sleep deprivation will result in death. If this is not linked in the article (it used to be).. I will find it again. Also, with regard to the gentleman that "never sleeps".... unless he has had a days (more than 24 hours) long EEG recording.... there is now way you can definitively say that he does not sleep. MrSandman 04:07, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

I posted that link about the Vietnamese guy up near the top of this page Did you see it somewhere else, and post it here? I am skeptical about it, not sure it's true, unless we put him through say a week long study with yes EEG testing we don't know.

I heard the record for staying fully awake is 11 days. And, yes experiments with rats have shown it's nessecary at least with rats or those particular rats. To do it they had them on a turn table and disturbed them when they tried to sleep so they couldn't. They eventually lost the ability to regulate thier body temperature and died. The snare 06:48, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Cattle sleep while standing?

I (as my username may suggest) raise cattle. I live in Alberta and see cattle all over the place. My Gido was a major cattle operator once owning over 100 head of cattle. I have never seen, nor heard of a cow sleeping while standing. They will do do it in a sitting position, or on thier sides, but not standing up. Kc4 07:12, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

I beleive giraffe's do it, as their necks are too large to manage lying down/getting back up again, they snap, apparently, in the process if they attempt to do so. I've not heard the same for cows and I've frequently seen them laying on their sides to sleep. Gohst 03:40, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

[edit] 7 vs. 8 hours

The Van Dongen et Al. paper looked only at 8, 6, and 4 hours of sleep concluding that 8 was enough and 6 was not. It makes no claims whatsoever about 7. Can someone please find a citation for 7 hours one way or the other? If not let't delete the statement. --Selket 04:57, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

According to the already linked CNN article "The National Sleep Foundation, which recommends eight hours of sleep per night for optimal health, immediately attacked the study's findings and said they can do nothing but cause the public unnecessary confusion and concern.". So I think the figure should be eight unless an even better source can be found. --CygnusPius 06:03, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Sleep according to age

I read the article in order to find the right scematics regarding the link between age and neccesity to sleep. Not finding it here, I searched for other recources, wondering wether or not it was bullocks that sleep and age are linked or if it was something that wasn't included yet.

What I found was a pretty clear graph that explains a study involving both factors and their inner linkage. You can find it here: http://www.teleac.nl/beterslapen/index.jsp?nr=574728#b578164 It's in Dutch indeed but the graph should be pretty clear.

I'm not an editor on WP myself so I will not attemp to produce this part in the article. Hope it could be included cause it seems to be something that is forgotten. If not, I appologize, just trying to make this thing more complete. --Chronix 0:26, 1 Februari 2007

Thanks for the notice. I'll see if I can fit some information into the article. Gohiking 15:45, 2 February 2007 (UTC)

[edit] Please fix this!!

someone vandalized the sleep page. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Zeamaes (talk • contribs) 05:03, 13 February 2007 (UTC).

[edit] Whales and dolphins??

Whales and dolphins are also different to humans: they always have to be conscious, as they are conscious breathers, so only one half of their brain sleeps at a time.[citation needed]

This would seem to contradict the suggestion in the first section that sleep is NOT a state of unconsciousness.

The sentence really doesn't make any sense. What I think it's trying to say is that the brain continues to be active during sleep. This is addressed later in the article, so I'm going to take the sentence out. If someone wants to put it back, please cite it. --Selket ^Talk 16:14, 20 March 2007 (UTC)